The effects of benefit cuts has begun. - Page 12

**Hugh** · 16-07-2012, 07:08

The lenders should not have loaned the money, then CDO'd/Securitised the loan bundles - however, people were also taking out loans they could not afford - the consumers were not entirely blameless......

LexDiamond · 16-07-2012, 08:19

Northern Rock was the beginning of the recession fir the UK. It was the one event that caused the collapse of the economy.

It is convenient to say banks causef this. But people have to take responsibility for their own actions. In this case Northern Rock did not get the credit because its consumer base was basically a bunch of people that wanted things they could not afford.

Again, it is convenient to say banks securitised debt. But this was toxic debt so the underlying loans were rotten which again comed back to the consumer. These consumers had no need to yake out debt and were under no obligation to do so.

Fact is that society has decided it would be convenient to blame people that are 'them' and not 'us' that live in places 'ordinary' folk don't. But the reality is that it is not the rich that caused this. If anything it was poor people that wanted to live beyond their means that caused this.

**Maggy J** · 16-07-2012, 08:25

I know the title of this thread is slightly ambiguous but I'm fairly certain we are now really wandering away from it..

Gavin78 · 16-07-2012, 11:47

So here is my story...my brother used to work for the royal armouries in leeds...they made a shed load of redundancies last year...they made a package deal for taking it voluntary or he could have stayed on and they could only keep his job for a further 6 months and he would have had to go with half of what the deal was.

He took a 23k payout...under the assumption he could claim housing benefit/jsa.

At least this is what he was told...what it came down to when he went to sign on he wasn't allowed to have anything while having that amount of money in his bank.

He has worked for the last 15 years in the same job I suggested he moved the money to my account while he got things sorted because I thought it was wrong that he at least couldn't sign on or claim something he was in effect forced out of his job.

He didn't want to do that so left it...now he signs on the house he is in is private rent its around Â£440 a month as I used to live with him but he was earning enough himself to take the place on on his own after I met/moved in with my now wife.

However under government changes instead of getting Â£99 a week towards the rent he only gets Â£61.50 he has to find around Â£200 a month of his benefits to find to put towards. he has the usual bills to pay gas/electric, food and water. he doesnt have anything fancy just a freeview box and telephone with VM.

To be honest I dont know how he will survive he is looking for work but explained to the job centre he only ever worked in 1 job since leaving school he doesn't know where to get another reference as most companies need 2. he has applied for a few jobs he's never been a layabout.

Now he hasn't become accustomed to any lifestyle but because its a 2 bed he has lived in for the last 7 years and is 33 years old he is classed as being able to "room share" with a load of other people "share accomodation rate"

Like he said to me this is my home its all my furniture I have built up over years I can't give it all away to start again with nothing this is my home. as far as they are concerned they dont care he is under 35 years old so not considered old enough to have a house and because they have left him in a rut he said its not like I can find a bond for another place because I have to pay Â£200 out a month out of my Â£280 a month benefits.

So how fare is this.

TheDaddy · 16-07-2012, 13:35

He should get a personal reference from a professional friend or tutors from courses he's been on. As for the rest, I hope he finds a job soon.

27monksbury · 17-07-2012, 14:36

I have no problems with people claiming and getting benefits that they are entitled to. But, the thousands of chancers claiming disability allowance and have nothing wrong with them. The people who have never worked ever when they can. The families who are professional scroungers and have never worked for generations and who work for cash in hand. The people on benefits in million pound houses, living the life only working people can dream of makes me sad. They are putting the retirement age up to 67. Some people are retired at 21. Old people have to sell their houses for care, and they scroungers can get millions during their lives. They can continue and get care for nothing when they are old. All on the back of we mugs. I must lie down now I'm worn out!

Angua · 17-07-2012, 15:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by 27monksbury

I have no problems with people claiming and getting benefits that they are entitled to. But, the thousands of chancers claiming disability allowance and have nothing wrong with them. The people who have never worked ever when they can. The families who are professional scroungers and have never worked for generations and who work for cash in hand. The people on benefits in million pound houses, living the life only working people can dream of makes me sad. They are putting the retirement age up to 67. Some people are retired at 21. Old people have to sell their houses for care, and they scroungers can get millions during their lives. They can continue and get care for nothing when they are old. All on the back of we mugs. I must lie down now I'm worn out!

Unfortunately in the OTT effort to catch this tiny minority of fraudsters it has been the innocent who have suffered. By both losing their benefits and being the true victims of the bile filled rhetoric from the press. No one, least of all the genuine wants to have fraudsters getting away with cheating the system. Sadly the method chosen has not caught the guilty who know all the loopholes.

peanut · 17-07-2012, 16:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Angua

Unfortunately in the OTT effort to catch this tiny minority of fraudsters it has been the innocent who have suffered. By both losing their benefits and being the true victims of the bile filled rhetoric from the press. No one, least of all the genuine wants to have fraudsters getting away with cheating the system. Sadly the method chosen has not caught the guilty who know all the loopholes.

I do agree with you but I don't think these cuts have anything to do with catching these fraudsters at all unfortunately.

Gary L · 17-07-2012, 16:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by peanut

I do agree with you but I don't think these cuts have anything to do with catching these fraudsters at all unfortunately.

It has nothing at all to do with catching anyone. it's sole purpose is to save money on the pretence that they're all cheats and dossers.

but the consequences may well outweigh the savings.
infact it's a cert. but we'll come to that bridge when we get to it.

**Mick** · 17-07-2012, 17:39

My Cousin has reported today that she had to take her Down Syndrome Son (My 2nd Cousin) to be medically assessed by ATOS to see if he was still DISABLED. The doctor asked her, was he born with Down Syndrome?. She replied very angrily, 'No he caught it when he was an infant'. What a muppet!

tizmeinnit · 17-07-2012, 17:42

That is one of the main points none of these are doctors none of them have any real training in the field they are just pen pushers and tricksters

He would have most likely written that comment down the decision makers will see it and say then it can not be downs and they will get their claim refused and they will have to appeal. Well maybe not but nothing surprises me with ATOS

AdamD · 26-07-2012, 02:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit

That is one of the main points none of these are doctors none of them have any real training in the field they are just pen pushers and tricksters

Starting to think the same of the mental health care service, too.

Finally got my appointment to see the local mental health team.

Asked a whole bunch of personal questions, which I was completely truthful with, including questions like "Do you have suicidal thoughts"

Despite telling them yes and in growing frequency, I'm apparently not depressed/suicidal/bipolar

Well gee, I'm sure glad to hear that, thoughts of jumping off the nearest tall building must be "normal", eh? Heh.

peanut · 31-07-2012, 03:17

At last, a bit of truth for a change. Well worth watching.

Dispatches - Britain on the sick - http://www.channel4.com/programmes/dispatches/4od

Panorama - Disabled or Faking It - http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode..._or_Faking_It/

RizzyKing · 31-07-2012, 12:42

Yes it was nice to see mainstream media finally showing ATOS for what they are and how badly the system operates but we need the wider public to both watch and get involved to ensure the system is put right.

**Maggy J** · 31-07-2012, 13:12

However...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-19046447

Quote:

The man in charge of reviewing the government's controversial fitness-to-work benefit assessments is to stand down, the BBC's Panorama has learned.
Professor Malcolm Harrington has called for a big overhaul of the process of testing claimants' ability to work to make it more "fair and humane".
He said ministers wanted a "fresh set of eyes" - but denied this was because of changes he had asked for.
Officials said he had only been recruited for a limited period.

Quote:

Prof Harrington said his recommendations had resulted in a fall in the number of those in the fit-to-work category and a rise in those in the work-related group - the most "difficult" group to assess.

A fresh pair of eyes eh? Pardon me for not buying that..