Funeral Soldiers Denied Bar Access

[Russ]

Originally Posted by Kymmy

Well it can be stressful as hell and they do need to unwind..

Possibly THE weakest and worst argument to justify their behaviour. No-one should deny the horrors that some soldiers will witness but that should never be taken as any sort of excuse to act the way some of them do when on civvy street.

[Kymmy]

Never said it was an argument, just a fact.. They are the ones when in the UK doing very intensive training, being taught that they fighters and then going out and defending all of us in hell holes like Afghanistan.. Unfortunately the locals with their "I can beat up a squaddie" attitude gets very thin after a time and things will/do happen..

Not saying it's right or wrong, what I am saying is that fights and then uniform bans are inevitable no matter which side starts or finishes it..

[Russ]

Originally Posted by Kymmy

Never said it was an argument, just a fact..

From what you said you made it sound like it was a justifiable reason for them to act like meatheads towards Joe Public.

Originally Posted by Kymmy

They are the ones when in the UK doing very intensive training, being taught that they fighters and then going out and defending all of us in hell holes like Afghanistan..

This is something I will always take issue with.

They are not 'defending all of us' anywhere. We are not at war with anyone. Neither are they 'fighting for our country/freedom' as some people say. All this is copied from the American-based rhetoric used with misty-eyes when describing their own military.

I stress no-one is going to underestimate the horrific job they do - even the most green 'ham-and-egg' rookie soldier has more courage than I will ever have however I only ask for perspective when discussing what they're doing. It is an occupation of a country. Some may call it an 'illegal war' (a subject for a different thread) but they are not defending us from anyone. Fantasists may say that if they were not in Afganistan etc then the population would take over the world etc but I don't that seriously.

So back to the subject at hand. They may well have the most stressful job in the world. Some (most?) may well be model citizens when out on the town. However those that are not can never have their cockiness justified or explained by the fact they have a 'stressful job'.

Unfortunately the locals with their "I can beat up a squaddie" attitude gets very thin after a time and things will/do happen..

Originally Posted by Kymmy

Unfortunately the locals with their "I can beat up a squaddie" attitude gets very thin after a time and things will/do happen..

Maybe someone with that sort of mentality needs their head kicked in.

[martyh]

Why didn't they simply take off the uniform ,the bar has a no uniform policy ,not a no squaddie policy

[danielf]

Originally Posted by martyh

Why didn't they simply take off the uniform ,the bar has a no uniform policy ,not a no squaddie policy

I tried walking into a pub in my underwear the other day. Strangely, they wouldn't let me in.

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by danielf

I tried walking into a pub in my underwear the other day. Strangely, they wouldn't let me in.

You've been drinking in the wrong bars, my local is just glad of the custom, clothed or otherwise

Congrats on the gold btw

[Derek]

Originally Posted by danielf

I don't think it says so anywhere in the article. Mind you: I've not heard of many pub fights involving off-duty policemen, firemen or nurses.

Erm. No comment

Originally Posted by Maggy J

Just out of interest is the no uniform rule applicable to other services like say policemen or firemen or nurses?

Yup. Certainly the Police aren't allowed to drink alcohol in uniform and not even accept any drink, alcoholic or otherwise, from a pub.

[Maggy J]

Originally Posted by Russ

And just as often it's the other way around.

Ahem! In Portsmouth for years during the 70s,80s there was 'tensions' between skates and Pompey knuckledraggers usually started by said kd because of the fact that the skates had all the money and got all the girls...and uniform very seldom entered into the argument unless the local girls just loved the uniform.
However Portsmouth has been a armed services port for several hundred years and everyone accepts that such tensions occur from time to time. Mostly both sides realise that they need each other financially and rub along together.If Portsmouth Naval Dockyard ever closes it will be a disaster for Portsmouth and so there is remarkably little trouble. So I think it's pretty much dependent on how much the Armed forces use a port or town on a regular basis.

[Kymmy]

Originally Posted by Maggy J

Ahem! In Portsmouth for years during the 70s,80s there was 'tensions' between skates and Pompey knuckledraggers usually started by said kd because of the fact that the skates had all the money and got all the girls...and uniform very seldom entered into the argument unless the local girls just loved the uniform.
However Portsmouth has been a armed services port for several hundred years and everyone accepts that such tensions occur from time to time. Mostly both sides realise that they need each other financially and rub along together.If Portsmouth Naval Dockyard ever closes it will be a disaster for Portsmouth and so there is remarkably little trouble. So I think it's pretty much dependent on how much the Armed forces use a port or town on a regular basis.

Portsmouth and Plymouth have always been different due to the town's population working in close proximity to the naval staff over the last few centuries

[Maggy J]

Originally Posted by Kymmy

Portsmouth and Plymouth have always been different due to the town's population working in close proximity to the naval staff over the last few centuries

But so have Army towns..they also find that the local barracks provide them with an income that they will miss if the local camp closes.

[Kymmy]

Originally Posted by Maggy J

But so have Army towns..they also find that the local barracks provide them with an income that they will miss if the local camp closes.

Yet most army barracks originally had few civvy staff (just auxillaries) as all trades were in house.. Naval would originally share docks so were more likely to mingle with the civvys..

It's all changed a lot these days but naval towns do tend to be more accepting of uniformed personel

[SMG]

Originally Posted by Russ

.
This is something I will always take issue with.

They are not 'defending all of us' anywhere. We are not at war with anyone. Neither are they 'fighting for our country/freedom' as some people say. All this is copied from the American-based rhetoric used with misty-eyes when describing their own military.

Wow Russ, what a pile of crap. If you took the time to see just how many US & UK soldiers are getting maimed, or killed trying to stop the spread of Islamic terrorism, you may come somewhere near the truth. We are at war & we have been for years, it may not have been declared, & it may not have come to your town, but if your son or daughter had walked through a minefield of IED`s whilst getting shot at, perhaps you`d share a tear for the fallen. What do you think would happen if we withdrew all our troops back home. Al Qaeda would say "Oh that's fine, we can leave them alone now".

They`d be in like rats up a drainpipe & blow your church to kingdom come, probably with you in it. There is no more dangerous soldier than the religious fanatic, who is prepared to die for a cause, & their cause is a world ruled by Islamic fanatics. Come on Russ, for crying out loud.

Regarding squaddies fighting, its very, very, rare for squaddies to fight in their No 2 uniform, its not fitted for flexibility believe me, its the best dress uniform, I do wonder if this bars record is to refuse bus drivers & nurses too.

[Russ]

Originally Posted by SMG

Wow Russ, what a pile of crap. If you took the time to see just how many US & UK soldiers are getting maimed, or killed trying to stop the spread of Islamic terrorism, you may come somewhere near the truth. We are at war & we have been for years, it may not have been declared, & it may not have come to your town, but if your son or daughter had walked through a minefield of IED`s whilst getting shot at, perhaps you`d share a tear for the fallen. What do you think would happen if we withdrew all our troops back home. Al Qaeda would say "Oh that's fine, we can leave them alone now".

Come on, come join us in the real world. We are NOT at war with anyone.

OK if your military experience has clouded your ability to see common sense then yes maybe you've bought in to the media soundbites of 'War on drugs', 'War on terror' etc

Just because I've explained to you how we are not at war with anyone does not mean I don't have sympathy with service personnel. Of course I do. But just to make it clear for you once more, our soldiers are not 'fighting for our country/freedom'. If you're happy to buy in to American sentimentality then good luck to you.

Islamic terrorism will not take over the world. It may increase but that would mean the rest of the world would be fighting for itself.

They do say the return to civvy street is a bit stressful for some eh?

[Maggy J]

I believe we are wandering away from the topic somewhat.

[SMG]

Originally Posted by Russ

Come on, come join us in the real world. We are NOT at war with anyone.

OK if your military experience has clouded your ability to see common sense then yes maybe you've bought in to the media soundbites of 'War on drugs', 'War on terror' etc

Just because I've explained to you how we are not at war with anyone does not mean I don't have sympathy with service personnel. Of course I do. But just to make it clear for you once more, our soldiers are not 'fighting for our country/freedom'. If you're happy to buy in to American sentimentality then good luck to you.

Islamic terrorism will not take over the world. It may increase but that would mean the rest of the world would be fighting for itself.

They do say the return to civvy street is a bit stressful for some eh?

Tell that to the 3 soldiers families who were killed today by a terrorist dressed as a policeman.