Eurozone will collapse...

[heero_yuy]

Originally Posted by Hugh

Do you actually read anything?

The EU gave Greece 110 billion euros of bailout loans in May 2010, and they didn't adopt any austerity measures then.

He just expects Greece to be given huge wedges of cash forever without doing something about retiring at 50, paying 14 months wages for 12 months work, not collecting taxes from the rich (funny stance that considering his abhorrance of the "rich") and all the other Spanish practices.

[Alan Fry]

Originally Posted by heero_yuy

He just expects Greece to be given huge wedges of cash forever without doing something about retiring at 50, paying 14 months wages for 12 months work, not collecting taxes from the rich (funny stance that considering his abhorrance of the "rich") and all the other Spanish practices.

What I want to do is for Greece to crack down on Tax Evation, but I feel that we shuod not force any other measures for the sake of the world economy!

[Chris]

Originally Posted by heero_yuy

He just expects Greece to be given huge wedges of cash forever without doing something about retiring at 50, paying 14 months wages for 12 months work, not collecting taxes from the rich (funny stance that considering his abhorrance of the "rich") and all the other Spanish practices.

Well naturally, it's the same old socialist fantasy, except in this version of it the never-ending money tree is a country called Germany.

[Alan Fry]

Originally Posted by Chris

Well naturally, it's the same old socialist fantasy, except in this version of it the never-ending money tree is a country called Germany.

What I am doing is demanding a worldwide radical reform to Capitalism and Democracy and a crackdown on the rich!!!

[Chris]

Yet you are demanding that Greece be given a pile of money *without* reforming.

[Alan Fry]

Originally Posted by Chris

Yet you are demanding that Greece be given a pile of money *without* reforming.

They should reform, not in favour of the rich (which is what they are doing right now), but for the rest of us (which is what I am suggesting)!

[denphone]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2...e-bailout-deal

Eurozone reaches deal on second Greece bailout after all-night talks

Eurozone finance ministers approve rescue package deal worth €130bn after 14 hours of negotiations in Brussels

[Alan Fry]

Originally Posted by denphone

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2...e-bailout-deal

The question is that will it be ever put into practise?

[richard1960]

Greece in my view would be much better off leaving the Eurozone the austerity measures are killing the country instead it has taken another pile of cash and will crush its people even more whilst the elite live the Euro dream that the man in the street pays for very sad indeed.

[chris9991]

I found the book Boomerang by Michael Lewis quite interesting (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Boomerang-Me.../dp/1846144841)

It has a chapter on various European countries and their story of how they found themeselves in trouble. The chapter on Greece is interesting and shows why there needs to be reforms. Essentially no one in Greece was paying any taxes and they were borrowing more and more money, in part, thanks to Goldman Sachs.

[Chris]

Whatever the problem, the EU's solution is always spend, spend, spend ...

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/da...to-spend-more/

The video clip on that page is well worth watching in full.

---------- Post added at 09:36 ---------- Previous post was at 09:22 ----------

Originally Posted by denphone

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2...e-bailout-deal

Have a look at this report into the agreement. You could be forgiven for thinking the Grauniad and Torygraph hacks were attending different events.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/f...or-Greece.html

By the Tele's reckoning, this is not just the nick-of-time solution that the Graun would have you believe it is. Greece has been forced to accept the permanent and significant presence of Euro-Gauleiters in the heart of its finance ministry. It has also been forced to create a ring-fenced bank account that will never contain less than three months' debt repayments.

The power to decide how and where to raise and to spend money is the fundamental benchmark of sovereignty. The EU is no longer gnawing at the edges of national sovereignty by mucking around with common agricultural, fisheries or even foreign policies, it has rammed a stake through the heart of the Greek state by installing itself in that country's economic policy too.

Of course, let's not forget that the current Greek government has agreed to this and bears responsibility for it too. The Greek people certainly won't forget when the elections come round in April and the parliament is stuffed with fringe lunatics from the hard left and the hard right who have promised to chuck the whole austerity thing in the Agaean.

[richard1960]

Originally Posted by Chris

Whatever the problem, the EU's solution is always spend, spend, spend ...

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/da...to-spend-more/

The video clip on that page is well worth watching in full.

Ah Daniel Hannan do not always agree with him but have heard him on LBC radio several times being interviewed and on this i tend to agree.

The Eurozone countries are artificially being held together in a money system that does not suit their economy and the people are suffering, the single currency is not a good idea for some countries and they should be allowed to leave rather then have this imposed on them.

[Alan Fry]

Originally Posted by richard1960

Greece in my view would be much better off leaving the Eurozone the austerity measures are killing the country instead it has taken another pile of cash and will crush its people even more whilst the elite live the Euro dream that the man in the street pays for very sad indeed.

Or they should get better terms with the bailout!

---------- Post added at 10:03 ---------- Previous post was at 10:01 ----------

Originally Posted by Chris

Whatever the problem, the EU's solution is always spend, spend, spend ...

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/da...to-spend-more/

The video clip on that page is well worth watching in full.

---------- Post added at 09:36 ---------- Previous post was at 09:22 ----------



Have a look at this report into the agreement. You could be forgiven for thinking the Grauniad and Torygraph hacks were attending different events.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/f...or-Greece.html

By the Tele's reckoning, this is not just the nick-of-time solution that the Graun would have you believe it is. Greece has been forced to accept the permanent and significant presence of Euro-Gauleiters in the heart of its finance ministry. It has also been forced to create a ring-fenced bank account that will never contain less than three months' debt repayments.

The power to decide how and where to raise and to spend money is the fundamental benchmark of sovereignty. The EU is no longer gnawing at the edges of national sovereignty by mucking around with common agricultural, fisheries or even foreign policies, it has rammed a stake through the heart of the Greek state by installing itself in that country's economic policy too.

Of course, let's not forget that the current Greek government has agreed to this and bears responsibility for it too. The Greek people certainly won't forget when the elections come round in April and the parliament is stuffed with fringe lunatics from the hard left and the hard right who have promised to chuck the whole austerity thing in the Agaean.

The Emergence of the "Peoples Republic of Greece" has taken another big step!

---------- Post added at 10:04 ---------- Previous post was at 10:03 ----------

I think that after The Eurozone crisis dies down (many years later), Europe (maybe the world) will be a changed place and not for the better...

[Osem]

I've heard a few commentators saying that this deal has as much to do with saving Sarkozy's job than anything else and I tend to agree. The Eurocrats in Chief just can't seem to accept that this thing cannot work in its current form and they're chucking yet more money at it in order to save face. The Greeks are in between a rock and a hard place but I tend to think the shorter term extreme pain of default would be better than the slow and painful torture they're going to suffer at the hands of the German/French led troika.

[heero_yuy]

Just kicking the can further down the road. Greece will never be in a position to make good on the deals "thrashed out" AKA cobbled together to save face. It cannot borrow money nor devalue its currancy to stimulate growth which are the only two realistic ways out unless Germany chooses to give them the money with no payback required.

I can't see the German electorate standing for that.

Meanwhile we're not out of it either:

Britain will have to pay an additional £1bn to help fund the IMF's new £110bn emergency fund to support stricken EU economies, according to senior members of the European Parliament. The move will increase the UK's total support of the IMF to £12.5bn, around £500 per British household.

Source