voting why hardly any media coverage???

[Kevin T]

Originally Posted by Osem

Well I'll give you a clue, the cash saved by the previous Tory governments is what Gordon Brown squandered until that ran out, he then sold half our gold reserves at a rock bottom price and proceeded to be so prudent that he gave us the biggest national debt in our history.

Well, actually, no. He spent that cash prudently.

The cash he squandered was that which he pillaged from private sector pension schemes....

[Osem]

Originally Posted by Cobbydaler

Well, actually, no. He spent that cash prudently.

The cash he squandered was that which he pillaged from private sector pension schemes....

Well he certainly did shaft the pension funds and the really sad thing is that all the inhabitants of Onlyevervotedlabour, Cloud Cuckoo Land were stupid enough to believe it was southern fat cats who'd been diddled as opposed to their own hard earned nesteggs.

Gordon Brown never did anything sensibly.

[kingbuxton]

Listen, I got into a Gov discussion a few weeks back that ended up in me getting a ticking off from the moderators, I aint doing that again

I know as far as Local rule goes only Labour have done anything with our cash, so I will stick with them......and I will leave it there. It's a Bank Holiday weekend, and that is all I am doing

What I will do in the general election, I dunno. I am one of those folk that wont really do any better under Tory or Liberal, educated, but living in a bad area........STOP.

[Xaccers]

So much for "we need to listen"
Just heard Ruth "Not really a bloke" Kelly saying that there wasn't a revulsion against Labour...

[slowcoach]

Locally, Labour is/has either completely rebuilt or completely refurbished every single school, under the Tories all the schools got was additional budget for more buckets to catch the drips from the leaking roofs.
Maybe, just maybe, future school leavers will not be quite as retarded as in the past.
Education is the answer to everything.

[foreverwar]

Have those schools been rebuilt under PFI?

Easy to spend money when someone else has to pay in 25 years.

[slowcoach]

Better the money be spent here, no matter where it came from, than frittering it all away in London and the South East trying to buy votes.
Under the Tories we got bugger all and Blair carried on the tradition, only recently have we seen any useful money coming this way, no doubt trying to buy back lost voters here.

[freezin]

Originally Posted by foreverwar

Less people voting.

But as you'd only just said that you "try not simplify cause and effect in complex situations" I'm sure you have a less flippant opinion about the drop in voter turnout.

[foreverwar]

Originally Posted by freezin

But as you'd only just said that you "try not simplify cause and effect in complex situations" I'm sure you have a less flippant opinion about the drop in voter turnout.

No, I don't.

I could witter on about perhaps how society and individuals appear to be more driven by blind consumerism and instant gratification than anything requiring analysis and thought, and these behaviours also appear to be happening in the political field, where it is difficult, if not impossible, to "fix" things in a few weeks or months, but since vox populi wants everything right now, soundbites, spin, and policy initiatives keep appearing willy-nilly (as in "you don't have to do anything, you just have to look as if your are doing something"), and as (usually, imho) quick-fixes don't work, nothing changes, very little improves, disillusionment sets in, and a downward spiral in voter involvement and belief carries on.

But I won't.

[freezin]

Originally Posted by foreverwar

No, I don't.

I could witter on about perhaps how society and individuals appear to be more driven by blind consumerism and instant gratification than anything requiring analysis and thought, and these behaviours also appear to be happening in the political field, where it is difficult, if not impossible, to "fix" things in a few weeks or months, but since vox populi wants everything right now, soundbites, spin, and policy initiatives keep appearing willy-nilly (as in "you don't have to do anything, you just have to look as if your are doing something"), and as (usually, imho) quick-fixes don't work, nothing changes, very little improves, disillusionment sets in, and a downward spiral in voter involvement and belief carries on.

But I won't.

You did, and a very interesting view it is. Thanks. It sounds like you sympathise with people who don't vote.

[foreverwar]

Originally Posted by freezin

You did, and a very interesting view it is. Thanks. It sounds like you sympathise with people who don't vote.

Thank you.

Whilst I understand why people don't vote, I don't sympathise/agree with them - imho, a vote unused is a vote wasted. If you/one wants things to change, do something - apathy very rarely achieves anything.

Which is why, whilst I often disagree with some people's political viewpoints, I am pleased to see them doing something (I have one exception to this, and you can probably guess which party this is (not UKIP) - but hey, we are in a pluralistic democratic society, and that is one of the features of it). When I was active in the Conservative Party, I often used to attend Militant Tendency rallies with my friend, who was a member of MT - we had widely disparate political views, but we liked a good debate.

Votes often aren't cast because "nothing will change" - it almost guarantees nothing will change if one doesn't vote, so there goes one self-fulfilling prophecy (again, imho).

As a wise philosopher once said - "These things take time".

If anyone wants an overnight fix, only a totalitarian government will give this; and (imho) the cure may be worse than the disease.

[kingbuxton]

@foreverwar, well put. You should vote, regardless of who, just do it, but how do you stop voter apathy? I am totally disillusioned with the entire system, I am Mr Average, so I can assume most of you are the same. I voted Labour to try and stop Liberals getting in, didn't work, Liberals are back in, so that is another term of taking all my money and doing......well I have no idea, for the last two years of Liberal rule they switched Garbage collection to two weeks, and couldn't even keep that up! And concreted over my entire childhood and moved, well I guess Liberal voters in (who else can afford a £200,000 house, I sure as hell can't). I am not happy.

Would love to be a protest voter, BNP, but they are insane, I am all for keeping the faith, but the last time I saw the BNP leader he was stood in front of a Spitfire and looked like he had been glassed in the face (dunno his name) may as well have been stood on an Indian shooting a Tiger.

I doubt Labour have a chance in the GE, the honeymoon is over as is always the case, so I will end up not bothering.

Me thinks the whole concept is due a change. Would the best of Labour, Tory and Liberal round a table not be the way forward? The way it is doesn't seem to work.

[Osem]

Originally Posted by slowcoach

Better the money be spent here, no matter where it came from, than frittering it all away in London and the South East trying to buy votes.

Really? So as long as it's done in the north you believe in spending vast sums of money you haven't got now and paying for it many times over later? .... and you don't call that buying votes?

Over the next few years the chickens are going to come home to roost on just how much debt these idiots have got us ALL into and when your flashy new schools start to leak and there's no money to fix them or staff them I guess you'll still be happy! You'll be equally happy I suppose that your pension and those of your long suffering countrymen have been withered away too?? You'll then take great delight in blaming future governemts (as long as they're not called Even Newer Labour) even though they weren't the ones who squandered all the money, they just have to pick up the pieces!

You really need to get out of your head out of the supposed North/South divide and smell the coffee. The people who'll suffer won't be a few international fat cats in London, they'll be the vast majority of ordinary hard working folk in this entire country who are just like you/yours and struggle to pay their mortgages but happen to have a different postcode.

[slowcoach]

Osem, all we ask is our fair share of the booty, after all we also pay income tax and VAT.
Don't forget that the Tories were in power for a very long time, and during that time we got bugger all, then up popped New Labour to give us some hope only to see it dashed.

New Labour only spent the money on the schools because the schools would have failed any health and safety checks.
A few years ago I was talking to two local lads that were about to leave school and start work, neither of them had ever used a computer, had no idea what Windows was and didn't know what a hard drive was, are you telling me that it's the same in London and the South East?

Please realize that I am not asking for fairness for myself, for the past 20 years I have sold my services mainly to London and the South East, it's just that I don't like to see hard working people getting the mucky end of the stick just because politicians think that some areas vote Labour and will always vote Labour, no matter what.

I am quite sure that if a lot of the waste and incompetence was removed there would be enough money available to please everyone.

[G UK]

Where does "North" Start then? By your definition I cant be in the "North as there has been Money spent round these parts.

I class myself as a midlander although I know a lot of people would say were also from up "North"