08-05-2007, 09:09
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#31
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cf.mega poster
Join Date: Mar 2004
Age: 22
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Re: Police Officer Shot Dead
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Originally Posted by zinglebarb
I know this isnt gonna go down well but imo if a lot of the illegal drugs were managed better in this country a lot of the real violent crime wouldnt be happening. Drug dealers keep guns for protection from other drug dealers this is your demand once there is demand there is supply. Take the criminal element out of drug culture and these violent criminals lose their job. The case in question here was a domestic gone bad god knows if the perp intended to use the gun on his partner/whatever but I bet he got the gun from someone involved in drugs
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I agree. Drugs is the problem with a lot of violent crime. It makes perfect sense for us to take the criminal profit from drugs. Finding a way to do it will be hard.
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08-05-2007, 09:22
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#32
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Cable Forum Team
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Re: Police Officer Shot Dead
Legislate and distribute through monitored points its the only way. Tax could bring in revenue. Opiates could be farmed legally taking the real money makers and terroists out of it . Heroin would be of a quality thats constant so the overdose deaths are less likely. Now I realise this might bring a few users in who wouldnt have used anyway but imo the fact it will be legal will mean most young easily influenced wont be interested as much as its legal .The drug law in this country is an ass anyway and costs a fortune in wasted time who cares about a bit of weed or speed if possession and use of these were not illegal it would free up police. Lets face it there isnt enough of them to focus on real crime as it is
I know this seems off topic but the drug culture and gun crime walk hand in hand there is no one without the other
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08-05-2007, 10:26
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#33
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BOFH :D
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: NW UK
Posts: 1,972
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Re: Police Officer Shot Dead
I may as well post this before someone else does and tries to use it to refute my comments before about licensing firearms to the public, apparently the .222 rifle used was a legally owned weapon.
This still doesn't change my opinion on the matter, this is an incident involving one licensed firearm, out of a hell of a lot more involving unlicensed ones.
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08-05-2007, 13:19
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#34
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cf.mega poster
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,211
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Re: Police Officer Shot Dead
Quote:
Originally Posted by Russ B
So the man was a police officer - does that make his death any more significant to, say, a security guard who gets killed on duty?
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Perhaps it does, if someone can murder a police officer they can murder anyone, that scares people, perhaps that's why it has long been advocated that 'cop killers' should receive a death sentence
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08-05-2007, 13:50
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#35
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cf.member
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 37
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Re: Police Officer Shot Dead
Quote:
Originally Posted by zinglebarb
Legislate and distribute through monitored points its the only way. Tax could bring in revenue. Opiates could be farmed legally taking the real money makers and terroists out of it . Heroin would be of a quality thats constant so the overdose deaths are less likely. Now I realise this might bring a few users in who wouldnt have used anyway but imo the fact it will be legal will mean most young easily influenced wont be interested as much as its legal .The drug law in this country is an ass anyway and costs a fortune in wasted time who cares about a bit of weed or speed if possession and use of these were not illegal it would free up police. Lets face it there isnt enough of them to focus on real crime as it is
I know this seems off topic but the drug culture and gun crime walk hand in hand there is no one without the other
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Hi,
Zinglebarb,i totally agree with you,not only are our drug laws an ass,but they make a bad situation worse! If drugs were legalised,controlled and taxed,not only would criminals not profit from them anymore,but the need for guns to protect their investment would be zero,as there is no more investment!!
Also there would be many fewer gang killings and gang wars cause there is nothing left for them to fight over. A lot of the killings amongst,unfortunatly mostly black, teens would stop.
And you are right,police would be free to tackle REAL CRIME,not drug users who hurt no one but themselves....
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08-05-2007, 14:20
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#36
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Cable Forum Team
Join Date: Jun 2003
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Re: Police Officer Shot Dead
Quote:
Originally Posted by Will21st
Hi,
Zinglebarb,i totally agree with you,not only are our drug laws an ass,but they make a bad situation worse! If drugs were legalised,controlled and taxed,not only would criminals not profit from them anymore,but the need for guns to protect their investment would be zero,as there is no more investment!!
Also there would be many fewer gang killings and gang wars cause there is nothing left for them to fight over. A lot of the killings amongst,unfortunatly mostly black, teens would stop.
And you are right,police would be free to tackle REAL CRIME,not drug users who hurt no one but themselves....
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You appear to have a very naiive view of drug use. Drug users who hurt no one but themselves? That's true of the people who smoke/do drugs within what they can afford, but what about those who mug/burgle people to feed their habit?
As for whether legalising drugs would solve the crime problems, I doubt it. Profit margins for the dealers are too high. They aren't going to let people use registered drug centres which will just bring the street prices down. After all, if they are happy to *kill* their competitors, killing legal competitors and a little arson isn't going to bother them.
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08-05-2007, 14:44
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#37
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cf.member
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 37
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Re: Police Officer Shot Dead
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuart C
You appear to have a very naiive view of drug use. Drug users who hurt no one but themselves? That's true of the people who smoke/do drugs within what they can afford, but what about those who mug/burgle people to feed their habit?
As for whether legalising drugs would solve the crime problems, I doubt it. Profit margins for the dealers are too high. They aren't going to let people use registered drug centres which will just bring the street prices down. After all, if they are happy to *kill* their competitors, killing legal competitors and a little arson isn't going to bother them.
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Naive? No. Realistic...
have you ever thought why addicts burgle and rob and steal to feed their habit? Cause the price for the drugs is artificially inflated by their prohibtion. If drugs were legal,the price would come down and they would be affordable.... apart from the fact that in no way am I trying to say that drugs are good or drug use is advisable... all i am saying is that drugs are a reality and we need to minimise harm....
Regarding your claim of dealers attacking legal vendors, i doubt it... never heard of the Mafia attacking them when the Americans ended their prohibition in 1933....
Also,do you really think we can do anything to make drugs go away??? No,we need to learn to accept them and not stigmatise those who use them. Or can you explain to me what the difference is between Alcoholism and cocaine addiction and which of the two is healthier and why one is therefore legal and the other illegal? 
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08-05-2007, 14:49
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#38
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cf.member
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Leamington Spa
Posts: 86
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Re: Police Officer Shot Dead
I agree that our drug laws, amongst other issues, serve us very badly when it comes to gangs and organised crime. The writer above misses the point, you only rob and mug for drugs when you cannot get them legaly and your addiction drives you to desperation. Factors such as those can be dealt with by society and still provide sufficient controls over drugs.
Take a look here: http://www.tdpf.org.uk/
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08-05-2007, 14:52
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#39
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cf.mega poster
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Milling around Milton Keynes
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Posts: 11,759
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Re: Police Officer Shot Dead
Where does this idea come from that drugs are expensive???
You can score 0.1g of heroin for around a tenner, 1g for about £40!
Even if it was a fiver for a hit, people will still break into houses to nick DVD players etc, or steal washing powder from the supermarket to sell round the estates in order to pay for it.
How did you think people would pay for it? Through their wages? What wages!?! If these users could hold down a job they wouldn't need to burgle to feed their habbits, why would legalising drugs change that?
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When I was younger I used to pray for a bike.
Then I realised god doesn't work like that, so I stole a bike and prayed for forgiveness.
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08-05-2007, 14:56
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#40
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Eric Cartman Wannabe
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Cockney geeza land
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Re: Police Officer Shot Dead
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuart C
To everyone who has posted on this thread saying the police should have guns:
In the past twenty years, we have had a handful of police officers shot while on duty (IIRC, the number is around 10 - I did post exact figures in another thread, but cannot find it).
Can you name a country where the police force is generally armed where the number of cops shot on duty is equal or less than our own?
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I can't find any hard statistics to quote but I believe Australia is less. I'm guessing Japan would be too.
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08-05-2007, 15:09
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#41
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cf.mega poster
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Milling around Milton Keynes
Age: 31
Posts: 11,759
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Re: Police Officer Shot Dead
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gavin
I can't find any hard statistics to quote but I believe Australia is less. I'm guessing Japan would be too.
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Japan are concerned that the number of gun related incidents surged to 25 by April 24th this year.
http://mdn.mainichi-msn.co.jp/nation...na023000c.html
__________________
When I was younger I used to pray for a bike.
Then I realised god doesn't work like that, so I stole a bike and prayed for forgiveness.
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08-05-2007, 15:13
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#42
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Eric Cartman Wannabe
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Cockney geeza land
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Posts: 12,171
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Re: Police Officer Shot Dead
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xaccers
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Stuart said police shootings though, not shootings in general.
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"Reach for the sky, 'cause tomorrow may never come" - Reach For The Sky (Social Distortion)
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08-05-2007, 15:21
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#43
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Cable Forum Team
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: It's Lahndun, Innit?
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Re: Police Officer Shot Dead
Quote:
Originally Posted by Will21st
Naive? No. Realistic...
have you ever thought why addicts burgle and rob and steal to feed their habit? Cause the price for the drugs is artificially inflated by their prohibtion. If drugs were legal,the price would come down and they would be affordable.... apart from the fact that in no way am I trying to say that drugs are good or drug use is advisable... all i am saying is that drugs are a reality and we need to minimise harm....
Regarding your claim of dealers attacking legal vendors, i doubt it... never heard of the Mafia attacking them when the Americans ended their prohibition in 1933....
Also,do you really think we can do anything to make drugs go away??? No,we need to learn to accept them and not stigmatise those who use them. Or can you explain to me what the difference is between Alcoholism and cocaine addiction and which of the two is healthier and why one is therefore legal and the other illegal? |
Neither Alcoholism nor cocaine addiction is healthy. One damages your heart. The other damages your liver. Both bad for you. As for what happens when you sell drugs legally, I suggest you look up what happened in Sweden in the late 70s and early 80s when they did try and legalise all drugs. Doesn't make for nice reading, and might go some way to explaining why Sweden has some of the toughest drugs laws in the world now.
I'm not trying to stigmatise drug use. Far from it, I have friends who use various kinds of drugs from all classes. I believe users should be helped.
__________________
Just to make it clear if a post is bold and is from a team member, it's a moderating decision. If it's not bold or not from a team member, it's not.
"This is an important announcement. This is flight 121 to Los Angeles. If your travel plans today do not include Los Angeles, now would be a perfect time to disembark.”
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08-05-2007, 15:31
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#44
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cf.member
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 37
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Re: Police Officer Shot Dead
Quote:
Originally Posted by LenMackin
I agree that our drug laws, amongst other issues, serve us very badly when it comes to gangs and organised crime. The writer above misses the point, you only rob and mug for drugs when you cannot get them legaly and your addiction drives you to desperation. Factors such as those can be dealt with by society and still provide sufficient controls over drugs.
Take a look here: http://www.tdpf.org.uk/
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Hi,
i am not missing the point... even users of legal drugs rob and kill to buy their 'fix',unfortunatly that is what adiction can do to an addicts personality.
I am aware of transform by the way.... 
---------- Post added at 16:31 ---------- Previous post was at 16:29 ----------
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuart C
Neither Alcoholism nor cocaine addiction is healthy. One damages your heart. The other damages your liver. Both bad for you. As for what happens when you sell drugs legally, I suggest you look up what happened in Sweden in the late 70s and early 80s when they did try and legalise all drugs. Doesn't make for nice reading, and might go some way to explaining why Sweden has some of the toughest drugs laws in the world now.
I'm not trying to stigmatise drug use. Far from it, I have friends who use various kinds of drugs from all classes. I believe users should be helped.
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very well, and how does it help a user by locking them up? And why don't we lock up alcoholics or smokers? Addiction is addiction....
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08-05-2007, 15:40
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#45
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Cable Forum Team
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Glasgow
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Re: Police Officer Shot Dead
Quote:
Originally Posted by Will21st
very well, and how does it help a user by locking them up? And why don't we lock up alcoholics or smokers? Addiction is addiction....
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It can allow them get help in order to try and get clean and while some legal drugs might push people into crime in my experience Heroin and Crack are the two most likely to cause their users to commit violence in order to obtain money for a fix.
Addiction is addiction but I've yet to see someone who hasn't had a fag for 24 hours break a pensioners collarbone while trying to steal her handbag.
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