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Does 8 Channels actually mean anything?
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Old 04-05-2012, 18:26   #1
cookster
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Does 8 Channels actually mean anything?

Woke up this morning and I'm now on 8 channels down. I'm already on 100M so nothng has change there.

Config file is also still 100/5

Does this mean I will be getting an increased upload soon?

BTW area is cpc1-asht6-2-0

Downstream Channels
Lock Status Modulation Channel ID Max Raw Bit Rate Frequency Power SNR Docsis/EuroDocsis locked
Locked QAM256 163 55616000 Kbits/sec 314750000 Hz 6.3 dBmV 42.8 dB Hybrid
Locked QAM256 157 55616000 Kbits/sec 266750000 Hz 6.0 dBmV 42.6 dB Hybrid
Locked QAM256 158 55616000 Kbits/sec 274750000 Hz 5.8 dBmV 42.9 dB Hybrid
Locked QAM256 159 55616000 Kbits/sec 282750000 Hz 5.5 dBmV 42.3 dB Hybrid
Locked QAM256 160 55616000 Kbits/sec 290750000 Hz 4.9 dBmV 42.5 dB Hybrid
Locked QAM256 161 55616000 Kbits/sec 298750000 Hz 6.3 dBmV 42.7 dB Hybrid
Locked QAM256 162 55616000 Kbits/sec 306750000 Hz 5.9 dBmV 42.8 dB Hybrid
Locked QAM256 164 55616000 Kbits/sec 322750000 Hz 6.2 dBmV 43.2 dB Hybrid
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Old 04-05-2012, 19:57   #2
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Re: Does 8 Channels actually mean anything?

just means more downstream capacity the upstream upgrades are separate AFAIK
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Old 04-05-2012, 20:23   #3
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Re: Does 8 Channels actually mean anything?

I noticed this week that I'm on 8 channels here in Welwyn Garden City, but we haven't been upgraded yet. Is there other work after the increase in channels before they implement the doubling?
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Old 05-05-2012, 03:24   #4
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Re: Does 8 Channels actually mean anything?

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Originally Posted by craigj2k12 View Post
just means more downstream capacity the upstream upgrades are separate AFAIK
Too much downstream capacity if you ask me.

8 channels times 55 megabits = over 400mbps of download capacity. Since TCP uses about 2% of that for ACKs, that's nearly half an upstream channel's completely gone even without anybody uploading a single thing.

(Course they do use ACK suppression so the actual effect may be lower)
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Old 05-05-2012, 03:42   #5
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Re: Does 8 Channels actually mean anything?

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Originally Posted by qasdfdsaq View Post
Too much downstream capacity if you ask me.

8 channels times 55 megabits = over 400mbps of download capacity. Since TCP uses about 2% of that for ACKs, that's nearly half an upstream channel's completely gone even without anybody uploading a single thing.

(Course they do use ACK suppression so the actual effect may be lower)
I wouldnt say too much downstream, more like too little upstream!! need at least 2 upstreams bonded, if the UK wasnt so far behind the rest of europe we would want more than that!!
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Old 05-05-2012, 04:03   #6
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Re: Does 8 Channels actually mean anything?

Funny that, every single FTTC customer (80/20) each gets as much dedicated upstream capacity as a whole VM upstream channel.
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Old 06-05-2012, 04:53   #7
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Re: Does 8 Channels actually mean anything?

Quote:
Originally Posted by qasdfdsaq View Post
Too much downstream capacity if you ask me.

8 channels times 55 megabits = over 400mbps of download capacity. Since TCP uses about 2% of that for ACKs, that's nearly half an upstream channel's completely gone even without anybody uploading a single thing.

(Course they do use ACK suppression so the actual effect may be lower)
I havent seen anything to indicate they do actually use ack surpression. All I have seen is a link that explains docsis supports it.

Also not everyone will have delayed acks enabled granted the majority of people will but some I expect for their own reasons may have it turned off, and some software selectively disables delayed acks as well.

I agree with craig anyway and you have it the wrong way round, the downstream isnt too high at 400mbit but rather the upstream is way too low.
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Old 06-05-2012, 11:23   #8
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Re: Does 8 Channels actually mean anything?

Admittedly, I've not done a wireshark dump or similar, but other performance metrics have suggested it. E.g. 50mbps download with only 500kbps of upstream, normally that wouldn't be possible.

And yes more upstream would be good, but it's all relative. I think we all agree there's too much downstream relative to the amount of upstream available or vice versa. Glass half full/glass half empty, but it's the relation of the two that's the problem.

(Though thought about another way, 2x20mbps = 40mbps upstream, which combined with 440mbps downstream, makes it almost bang on 10:1 ratio, though then there's the relative efficiencies at which the two could be used also playing a part)
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Old 06-05-2012, 13:27   #9
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Re: Does 8 Channels actually mean anything?

My area's been uplifted with 4 channels still.

No performance issues to report though.
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Old 06-05-2012, 21:06   #10
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Re: Does 8 Channels actually mean anything?

Ok here is my theories.

Most areas appear to not be heading to 8 downstreams, I think this thread is the 3rd person I have seen on the entire internet with 8, ignition only has 4 and most seems to be getting 5 or 6.

My area gives me full speed now with 5, and it didnt with 4, my neighbour on the 100mbit service doesnt get full speed still but it did improve when the extra channel was added. Ignition gets full with 4 channels, so obviously still huge variation going on with VMs network area by area. Expected given the small size of the pipes.

I think there is other upgrades that have been done side by side like a node split or something because my US has been improved for the past week or 2 yet there is no new US channels so something was done to improve that as well. Are they shrinking the service groups? Or was that unique to my port because there was a high utilisation fault hmm.

US bonding is coming according to ignition, we dont yet know if thats just existing channels or new ones been used. But if they halved each US group via node splits and then bonded existing channels thats still a doubling of capacity. Although in my view not enough I suppose its something.

As it stands now I am fairly happy with my service and it would be nice if they left it as is but of course the upload speeds are been doubled at some point so this is probably a temporary situation until that happens.
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Old 07-05-2012, 20:32   #11
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Re: Does 8 Channels actually mean anything?

Still on 4 downstreams here in SM4 (fed from New Malden) Utilisation is starting to creep up again and affect 50 Mb/s performance on the business service. A nodespilt earlier this year really helped, but it's degrading again now.

I am in one of the last areas to get the upstream network improvemtns similar to Ignition. My area is due to have the speed doubling done between April & July, so I wonder if I will see more than 4 upstreams before that is done.
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Old 08-05-2012, 02:52   #12
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Re: Does 8 Channels actually mean anything?

I don't care what they do to increase upstream capacity, as long as they do it.
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Old 08-05-2012, 23:37   #13
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Re: Does 8 Channels actually mean anything?

The actual question was "does 8 channels actually mean anything?". There are a couple of points at least as an answer:

1/
8 DS channels makes you 200 meg ready subject to other conditions being right.

2/
8 DS channels implies ugraded capacity in your segment - possibly soon to be swallowed up by additional customers and/or mega-downloaders.

IMO it also makes the SH work harder to reassemble 8 streams of interleaved data.

BTW, I've seen a couple of bonded upstream channels reported on VM cable.
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Old 09-05-2012, 01:45   #14
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Re: Does 8 Channels actually mean anything?

Seph, we've changed from 4 to 6 after an 'upgrade' from 30 to 60Mb. Superhub in modem mode attached to DIR-615 and every time the connection goes t**s up the whole lot crashes. Got to say I'm very upset
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Old 09-05-2012, 07:59   #15
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Re: Does 8 Channels actually mean anything?

DIR-615 crashes too?
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