Maximum rates with daytime + evening STM in force

[Pogo stick]

Originally Posted by Mad Ad

No its not the same, when we say downloading AT X we acknowledge there is a time factor involved. When we say we have downloaded X, thats an absolute amount.

It is over 15 years since I got my maths degree, so I'm a bit rusty, but lets see if I can still do this...

1188Gb/day x 1 day = amount downloaded in one day

let's see...in the left hand expression the 'day' is both above and below the line so those terms cancel leaving the expression:

1188Gb x 1 = Amount downloaded in one day

Therefore the amount downloaded in one day = 1188Gb

math 101 as they say in the States

[Mad Ad]

Originally Posted by Pogo stick

Good point and if you think about it, a docsis 3.0 50Mb connection STM-d to, let's say, 10Mb is exactly that, with the added advantage of the occasional burst to 50Mb.

So depending on how you view it, the new product you mention is, in fact, coming soon: late 2008/early 2009, though will be more than £37/month I expect but I assume the 10Mb non-STMd product you mention above would also have had a premium price

The problem with that is despite being 10 meg after STM, itll also have a puny uprate of 384k, which, because of the way ciscos STM drops packets, will only be usable to about 300k before the latency starts to rise to a crippling level (ever tried having a voip call or playing xbox with a 1 second delay? forget it).

384 is no way enough for 10 meg**, its yet another BS way that Alex at VM has cut down what you do get left with.

**(10 meg originally came with 768k up, and even that was poor)

[ceedee]

For those (like me) who are a little challenged by the maths:

Unrestricted speed = 20Mb/s = 9GB/hour
Restricted speed = 5Mb/s = 2.25GB/hour

00:00-10:00	Unrestricted download for 10 hours = 90GB
10:00-10:36	Unrestricted download for 36mins = 6GB
10:36-15:36	STM @ 5Mb/s for 5 hours = 11.25GB
15:36-16:18	Unrestricted download for 42mins = 6.3GB
16:18-21:18	STM @ 5Mb/s for 5 hours = 11.25GB
21:18-23:59	Unrestricted download for 2 hours 42mins = 24.3GB

Unrestricted download =	126.6GB 
Restricted download = 	 22.5GB
Total downloaded = 	149.1GB

Unrestricted hours =	14:00 
Restricted hours = 	10:00
Total hours = 		24:00

Average speed = 13.8Mb/s

[Mad Ad]

Originally Posted by Pogo stick

It is over 15 years since I got my maths degree, so I'm a bit rusty, but lets see if I can still do this...

1188Gb/day x 1 day = amount downloaded in one day

let's see...in the left hand expression the 'day' is both above and below the line so those terms cancel leaving the expression:

1188Gb x 1 = Amount downloaded in one day

Therefore the amount downloaded in one day = 1188Gb

math 101 as they say in the States

Its not the math, its the units. Canceling the terms out doesnt change the fact that as soon as you mention a time factor (per day hour or second) then the unit is a rate. When you dont mention a time factor, the unit is an amount.

Amounts are most commonly measured in Gigabytes, and not Gigabits, and certainly not Gigabits per day. Thats a rate.

Originally Posted by ceedee

For those (like me) who are a little challenged by the maths:

Unrestricted speed = 20Mb/s = 9GB/hour
Restricted speed = 5Mb/s = 2.25GB/hour

00:00-10:00    Unrestricted download for 10 hours = 90GB
10:00-10:36    Unrestricted download for 36mins = 6GB
10:36-15:36    STM @ 5Mb/s for 5 hours = 11.25GB
15:36-16:18    Unrestricted download for 42mins = 6.3GB
16:18-21:18    STM @ 5Mb/s for 5 hours = 11.25GB
21:18-23:59    Unrestricted download for 2 hours 42mins = 24.3GB

Unrestricted download =    126.6GB 
Restricted download =      22.5GB
Total downloaded =     149.1GB

Unrestricted hours =    14:00 
Restricted hours =     10:00
Total hours =         24:00

Average speed = 13.8Mb/s

Almost correct, well done, except you are a few minutes out.

If, as you correctly say, its 9 gig an hour, and the day allowance is 6 gig, with the evening 3 gig, then thats 40 mins and 20 mins squarely. Adjust that and you have the gold.

[pippincp]

Originally Posted by ceedee

For those (like me) who are a little challenged by the maths:

Unrestricted speed = 20Mb/s = 9GB/hour
Restricted speed = 5Mb/s = 2.25GB/hour

00:00-10:00	Unrestricted download for 10 hours = 90GB
10:00-10:36	Unrestricted download for 36mins = 6GB
10:36-15:36	STM @ 5Mb/s for 5 hours = 11.25GB
15:36-16:18	Unrestricted download for 42mins = 6.3GB
16:18-21:18	STM @ 5Mb/s for 5 hours = 11.25GB
21:18-23:59	Unrestricted download for 2 hours 42mins = 24.3GB

Unrestricted download =	126.6GB 
Restricted download = 	 22.5GB
Total downloaded = 	149.1GB

Unrestricted hours =	14:00 
Restricted hours = 	10:00
Total hours = 		24:00

Average speed = 13.8Mb/s

I like this one!

To me speed is money - not for illegal pirposes I must add! - I charge for solving PC problems via remote access to them.

I get paid for what I do and what I supply and quite rightly so.

If I was still with VM I would be paying for 20Mbps and only getting 13.8Mbps I only wish it were true. My average speed when I was with VM was struggling to get to 10Mbps and that's before STM came in! I had countless engineers come who could not find a problem at my end (surprise, surprise!) and couldn't find a problem at theirs.

I did meet an engineer on his party for leaving VM who told me that 50db attenuators should have been fitted to the street cabs to cut the noise on the lines but they hadn't been done. How true that is I don't know.

Getting back to the point though, to pay for 20Mbps and only getting 13.8Mbps is a rip off especially as it was originally sold as a "Premium" service.

Rant over.

[Pogo stick]

Originally Posted by Mad Ad

Its not the math, its the units. Canceling the terms out doesnt change the fact that as soon as you mention a time factor (per day hour or second) then the unit is a rate. When you dont mention a time factor, the unit is an amount.

Amounts are most commonly measured in Gigabytes, and not Gigabits, and certainly not Gigabits per day. Thats a rate.

Not quite sure I understand your issue here Mad Ad, but if it's that you want it in GB, then fine, 149GB a day, or ~4470GB a month, is still quite some 'limit' compared to most other ISPs (e.g. Sky's hard cap at 750GB a month)

[Mad Ad]

Originally Posted by pippincp

I like this one!

To me speed is money - not for illegal pirposes I must add! - I charge for solving PC problems via remote access to them.

I get paid for what I do and what I supply and quite rightly so.

If I was still with VM I would be paying for 20Mbps and only getting 13.8Mbps I only wish it were true. My average speed when I was with VM was struggling to get to 10Mbps and that's before STM came in! I had countless engineers come who could not find a problem at my end (surprise, surprise!) and couldn't find a problem at theirs.

I did meet an engineer on his party for leaving VM who told me that 50db attenuators should have been fitted to the street cabs to cut the noise on the lines but they hadn't been done. How true that is I don't know.

Getting back to the point though, to pay for 20Mbps and only getting 13.8Mbps is a rip off especially as it was originally sold as a "Premium" service.

Rant over.

See the post above yours, its 13.75 meg as I said in my original post

Originally Posted by Pogo stick

Not quite sure I understand your issue here Mad Ad, but if it's that you want it in GB, then fine, 149GB a day, or ~4470GB a month, is still quite some 'limit' compared to most other ISPs (e.g. Sky's hard cap at 750GB a month)

Not to quibble, but its 148.5, but anyway..... what you are now discussing is an opinion and outside the scope of this thread. However briefly, compared with some lower end packages yes its a good amount in a day IF, and only IF you can use the off peak time to its fullest. Many cannot tho, my biggest gripe is how we cannot rely on a fixed amount any more, something the lower capacity ADSL packages still provide (meaning the difference between the boom and the bust is so large, and at a time when most everyone wants to use it, in the evening). Anyway like i said, thats discussion outside of whats intended here.

[Pogo stick]

Originally Posted by Mad Ad

See the post above, its 13.75 meg as I said in my original post


Quote:

Not to quibble, but its 148.5, but anyway..... what you are now discussing is an opinion and outside the scope of this thread. However briefly, compared with some lower end packages yes its a good amount in a day IF, and only IF you can use the off peak time to its fullest. Many cannot tho, my biggest gripe is how we cannot rely on a fixed amount any more, something the lower capacity ADSL packages still provide (meaning the difference between the boom and the bust is so large, and at a time when most everyone wants to use it, in the evening). Anyway like i said, thats discussion outside of whats intended here.

and I thought I was the picky one

Where, in that quote, or in fact anything I have written in this thread, am I giving my opinion? I have, so far as I'm aware only given factual statement, logical argument or mathematical proof thus far.

If you think it's opinion to state that a possible download limit of approx 4470GB (or 4.47TB) every month is still quite some limit compared to Sky's 750MB a month, then I apologise. I will retract that comment and replace it with the more factual statement I guess you would prefer...

With VM, every month, you can download >3.5TB more than you can with Sky (Contention notwithstanding, obviously)

[darthlinux]

On your comment about 750Gb month that is based on sky users living near the exchange and getting 13mb+ speed right?

Originally Posted by darthlinux

On your comment about 750Gb month that is based on sky users living near the exchange and getting 13mb+ speed right?

You know, you dont have to be near an exchange to get good speeds.

[darthlinux]

Originally Posted by TraxData

You know, you dont have to be near an exchange to get good speeds.

Trax what you smoking the closer you are to the exchange with ADSL the better speeds you get

Originally Posted by darthlinux

Trax what you smoking the closer you are to the exchange with ADSL the better speeds you get

But you still dont need to be right next to an exchange to get good speeds like you seem to be implying

[Pogo stick]

Originally Posted by darthlinux

On your comment about 750Gb month that is based on sky users living near the exchange and getting 13mb+ speed right?

The 750Mb hard cap for Sky is based on the quote from TraxData on the thread linked by the OP in the 1st post of this thread (sorry Trax, should have ref'd the quote) I imagine this cap is irrespective of speed and proximity to the exchange.

[Chrysalis]

Originally Posted by darthlinux

On your comment about 750Gb month that is based on sky users living near the exchange and getting 13mb+ speed right?

to do 750gig month a 2.5mbit synch is enough.

Thanks to the OP. It would be interesting to see figures if you avoid being traffic shaped (i.e. no downloading during periods of throttling, so you can browse and download files/email normally without fear of having your internet connection crippled).

The reason I mention it is that before this nonsense started I had uTorrent set up not to download anything between 4pm and 9pm. Traffic shaping absolutely kills my connection, so that even if I then stop download web browsing is slow and pages time out, gaming is impossible and streaming video cuts out a lot.