50Mbit Rollout Has Started

[BBKing]

Oddly enough, I see it not as a money spinner (although shifting the 20Mb guys to the new kit where possible might be, since it keeps high paying customers happier and reduces network load that tarnishes the experience for everyone) but more of a 'hey look what we can do, up yours ADSL' idea. The top tiers are never where the money is in broadband, but if you can get the glitz to rub on on the service that the bread-and-butter M and L guys get, you'll hopefully keep them loyal, which is a key part of the battle we're in.

In much the same way, Virgin Galactic's image rubs off a bit onto Virgin Atlantic.

Mind you, billing them correctly and sorting out their problems in an efficient manner won't be money wasted, for that matter. Call me old-fashioned.

[broadbandbug]

Originally Posted by BBKing

Oddly enough, I see it not as a money spinner (although shifting the 20Mb guys to the new kit where possible might be, since it keeps high paying customers happier and reduces network load that tarnishes the experience for everyone) but more of a 'hey look what we can do, up yours ADSL' idea. The top tiers are never where the money is in broadband, but if you can get the glitz to rub on on the service that the bread-and-butter M and L guys get, you'll hopefully keep them loyal, which is a key part of the battle we're in.

In much the same way, Virgin Galactic's image rubs off a bit onto Virgin Atlantic.

Mind you, billing them correctly and sorting out their problems in an efficient manner won't be money wasted, for that matter. Call me old-fashioned.

I agree with you that it can (and will) make the 20Mb/s Tier more stable and provide a fair amount of 'burst headroom' for the L & M Tiers left on the DoCSIS 1 Platform.
Also agree with the 50Mb/s comments (for now), in my mind there will be a raft of new 'services' to take advantage of the added capability of 50Mb/s Downstream. i.e. HD Video Multicast etc that will be value add for those that want to reach deeper into their pockets.. But at the end of the day it is the 2.5 Million 2Mb/s customers that actually pull the revenue through the door

[iglu]

Is this the new modem?

or this one?

The latter can do 195Mbps in EuroDOCSIS 3

[BenMcr]

If it is the Ambit one I'm a bit disappointed. I thought it would look different than the 2.0 one lol

[Stuart C]

Originally Posted by BBKing

Oddly enough, I see it not as a money spinner (although shifting the 20Mb guys to the new kit where possible might be, since it keeps high paying customers happier and reduces network load that tarnishes the experience for everyone) but more of a 'hey look what we can do, up yours ADSL' idea. The top tiers are never where the money is in broadband, but if you can get the glitz to rub on on the service that the bread-and-butter M and L guys get, you'll hopefully keep them loyal, which is a key part of the battle we're in.

In much the same way, Virgin Galactic's image rubs off a bit onto Virgin Atlantic.

Mind you, billing them correctly and sorting out their problems in an efficient manner won't be money wasted, for that matter. Call me old-fashioned.

The trouble is that Virgin seem to court good publicity. Well, they try to, anyway. Billing people correctly and sorting out problems efficiently doesn't get headlines and any real improvement isn't something they can boast about, as it would be an admission they had problems before.

Rolling out 50 meg (even if large parts of the network aren't ready) will get those headlines, as no other residential broadband supplier can supply speeds that fast.

[broadbandbug]

Originally Posted by Stuart C

The trouble is that Virgin seem to court good publicity. Well, they try to, anyway. Billing people correctly and sorting out problems efficiently doesn't get headlines and any real improvement isn't something they can boast about, as it would be an admission they had problems before.

Rolling out 50 meg (even if large parts of the network aren't ready) will get those headlines, as no other residential broadband supplier can supply speeds that fast.

They are not allowed to 'court the headlines' with 50Mb/s until it is available to the majority of the customer base

[popper]

interesting details about the EU cable growth, and how most but VM UK did well, even the irish chorus cable bettered VM even though its using the old sold ex-(pre-)VM infrastructure...

infact the official PDF data seems to indicate that both TV and phone are growth area's even though VOD and tv are somewhat limited for fast content acquisition turn around.

were does that leave Neil's (HD!) VOD policy,the current other half of the great VM Broadband profitability comback ?

http://www.cableeurope.eu/uploads/do...esentation.pdf
Development of new content services is hindered by current
[b]copyright clearance system/B]

�� system does not respond to needs of VOD and new digital TV services

http://www.digitaltvnews.net/content/?p=2974

on that VOD/TV Content note theres also this
http://www.marketingweek.co.uk/cgi-b...=258&h=262&f=3
"
Virgin Media TV appoints MG OMD and Goodstuff

28-Apr-08
.
Virgin Media TV has appointed Manning Gottlieb OMD and Goodstuff to handle its £5m media planning and buying business. It was previously handled by PHD Rocket, which pulled out of the pitch.

The agencies pitched against Carat, Starcom and Mediaedge:cia to win the account. It was handled by Billetts. The account now will be split with Goodstuff handling the TV planning and MG OMD looking after the buying.

The pair will now work across the company’s portfolio of seven channels, including Virgin 1, Living, Bravo, Challenge and Trouble. A bulk of the media budget is split between Virgin 1 and Living."

why would a company get the contract and then pull out long before its contract term finished?

http://www.brandrepublic.com/News/80...dstuff-MG-OMD/
"....
The business covers planning and buying across Virgin's seven channels
including Virgin 1, Living, Bravo, Challenge and Trouble.

The review, called last February, was run by Billetts.
"

when you collate all the data so far regarding Neil's grand 2 tear plan, does it seem logical for your VOD/TV content 3rd party contractor to pull out, oi find it rather odd..., money flow or the lack of it, seems to be the only obvious factor there.

it makes me wonder how is the Docsis 50Mbit 3rd party contracting going if that too was effected by money flow!



---------- Post added at 00:28 ---------- Previous post was at 00:25 ----------

Originally Posted by broadbandbug

They are not allowed to 'court the headlines' with 50Mb/s until it is available to the majority of the customer base

that might be the case in the US BBG, but it happens that VM have been advertising the 50Mbit up and coming service for a very long time now ,far to long infact, some might say.

[BenMcr]

did it really have to be that big?

[popper]

Originally Posted by BenMcr

If it is the Ambit one I'm a bit disappointed. I thought it would look different than the 2.0 one lol

i supose its all down to VMs contracts and supply chain Ben, given theres no data on the D3 as yet on that page,
it did strike me as interesting theres also several existing "Ambit's Wireless Cable Modem Router combines a robust cable modem with the freedom of wireless." in both 11g and 11n format.

id imagine the Ambit D3 models could, infact probably would also come in such a wireless 11n router format (with 4 intigrated cheap RTL chip 1gig rj45 ports hopefully).
http://europeasia.ambitbroadband.com...t.aspx?pk=0006

its a shame we probably wont get to use them if they do or will exist soon, as the VM supply chain management policy seems to always go for the cheapest off the shelf item going at any given time.

do you know if they might source and at least beta trial such kit on a large scale ?.

[Chrysalis]

Originally Posted by BBKing

Oddly enough, I see it not as a money spinner (although shifting the 20Mb guys to the new kit where possible might be, since it keeps high paying customers happier and reduces network load that tarnishes the experience for everyone) but more of a 'hey look what we can do, up yours ADSL' idea. The top tiers are never where the money is in broadband, but if you can get the glitz to rub on on the service that the bread-and-butter M and L guys get, you'll hopefully keep them loyal, which is a key part of the battle we're in.

In much the same way, Virgin Galactic's image rubs off a bit onto Virgin Atlantic.

Mind you, billing them correctly and sorting out their problems in an efficient manner won't be money wasted, for that matter. Call me old-fashioned.

Too true, the high speeds are all about headlines.

only 25% of adsl1 customers can get a 8meg synch, it will be a very low % single figures on adsl2+ but BT etc. wont care as 24mbit will be the headline speed which beats cables current 20meg.

Of course cable then retalliate with their 50meg. The next move will either be vdsl2 of BT to match 50meg but would require FTTC. or a 100meg over FTTH both years away. So cable will have the lead for a while now.

[hokkers999]

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

Too true, the high speeds are all about headlines.

only 25% of adsl1 customers can get a 8meg synch, it will be a very low % single figures on adsl2+ but BT etc. wont care as 24mbit will be the headline speed which beats cables current 20meg.

Of course cable then retalliate with their 50meg. The next move will either be vdsl2 of BT to match 50meg but would require FTTC. or a 100meg over FTTH both years away. So cable will have the lead for a while now.

But would you rather have 50meg for 10 minutes then be choked right back for the rest of them time - STM hours are continually increasing - or say 8meg adsl2 that just stays that way with no stm?

[jem]

Originally Posted by hokkers999

But would you rather have 50meg for 10 minutes then be choked right back for the rest of them time - STM hours are continually increasing - or say 8meg adsl2 that just stays that way with no stm?

Well I certainly know what I'd prefer but Chrysalis is absolutely right-it's all about marketing and what most people perceive is the better option.

We who regularly read and contribute to these forums are a small minority. I'd guess that the vast majority of broadband users (not just VM) have no idea what speed they are actually getting and are hardly ever affected by caps or limits so it simply isn't an issue. Similarly I expect the majority of VM users (as VM themselves claim) just use the internet for a bit of web browsing, email etc. and never hit the STM limits. Video streaming and other high bandwidth usages are very much a minority activity (but growing thanks to the BBC iPlayer et. al. hence the ISPs wanting the BBC to help fund improvements in the infrastructure).

So for the average 'punter' who sees two competing ISPs; one offering a stable and guaranteed 8 Meg (say) with no download limits or throttling and the second (maybe with a cheaper headline price) offering upto 24 or 50 Meg with no download limit (which VM claim and it is technically correct even though with STM it is stretching the truth); who are they going to sign up with? No contest really is it!

[Rone]

I'm still waiting till they roll out a decent 20meg service............

[Chrysalis]

Originally Posted by hokkers999

But would you rather have 50meg for 10 minutes then be choked right back for the rest of them time - STM hours are continually increasing - or say 8meg adsl2 that just stays that way with no stm?

Getting it for 10 minutes is better than not getting it at all.

BTs 21CN is going to price 24mbit adsl2+ the same as adsl 8mbit, there is probably going to be a load of super cheap adsl2+ deals post 21CN, so on top of throttling etc. (which does exist in the adsl world) there will be users who eg. pay for 24mbit but can only burst to eg. 2mbit due to line quality. So when you think of it that way cable is most defenitly better.

---------- Post added at 14:41 ---------- Previous post was at 14:39 ----------

It is interesting that the advertising rules are different for broadband than other things. APR rates for loans etc. the rate they put as typical has to apply to a majority of customers, whilst broadband advertisers can get away with quoting what applies to a minority of customers.

[popper]

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

Too true, the high speeds are all about headlines.

only 25% of adsl1 customers can get a 8meg synch, it will be a very low % single figures on adsl2+ but BT etc. wont care as 24mbit will be the headline speed which beats cables current 20meg.

Of course cable then retalliate with their 50meg. The next move will either be vdsl2 of BT to match 50meg but would require FTTC. or a 100meg over FTTH both years away. So cable will have the lead for a while now.

im just reading up on the proposed

Business Access over Twisted Copper using

IEEE 802.3ah Native Ethernet

it's interesting , not least in its ability to autoconfigure or for your MS centric reader plug-and-play, bonding.
http://downloads.lightreading.com/wp...dCopper_wp.pdf

OC its not just the *DSL companys domain, its also quite possible to use this IEEE 802.3ah Native Ethernet over such as the spare wires inside the ex-pre-VM telephone cable,Nynex/C&W used really high grade multicore Twisted pair on the phonelines thats just sat there almost unused.

"

The resiliency of 802.3ah loop aggregation can satisfy the most demanding business customers and support any application.

When a pair fails, that pair is detected and removed from the aggregate
in just a few milliseconds. Established Voice-over-IP calls remain operational, and the callers don’t even notice that a problem has occurred. Video streams continue to play as if nothing has changed.

Applications, and their users are unable to detect that one of the pairs has failed, except by the loss of some bandwidth. And when that pair comes back online, it is seamlessly added to the aggregate.

That again goes unnoticed by the applications and users. This makes IEEE 802.3ah the most suitable technology for the business services of today and tomorrow, where unreliable, best-effort

delivery is simply not enough.
"