virgin media's future

[ottoni]

Was just reading through some of the bt vision forums on DS, and someone was asking for advice on what bt vision is like. Someone on there explained that you have to get out of the 'mindset' of it offering 'channels' but more programmes and ondemand stuff.
Maybe this is how we should start to view VM, as its become known, we have been totally screwed over when it comes to sky premium channels, with VM's negotiators obviously living in cloud cookoo land.
Things that are fundamentally wrong with VM:

Old and tired looking UI
Lack of SD and HD channels
terrible communication when it comes to new channels or content launching
an out of date VIP PACK
Sky premium basics and premium negotiations were, to say the least poor.
Taking channels away!

(these are just general comments I have seen on this and other forums)

BUT? What about good things?

VM have got their head together on adding HD, BUT still slack behind SKY, some obvious ones still missing: SKY1HD, NATGEO WILD HD, BIO HD ETC

tivo launching sounds interesting

on demand is excellent

free call outs a bonus!

whats your opinions? and what could they do better?, maybe vm wants to concentrate on VOD rather than linear broadcasts.

[nialli]

"Things that are fundamentally wrong with VM"?

Old and tired looking UI
Wait until TiVo launches at the end of the year. Sky's HD EPG is no better than Virgin's and already looks dated. TiVo will be different.
Lack of SD and HD channels
Believe it or not, we don't all want hundreds and hundreds of useless channels. The only channel available on Sky that I would want is Sky1 HD, and that's launching on Virgin shortly
terrible communication when it comes to new channels or content launching
I wouldn't say it was "terrible" but there is always room for improvement. Too often though folk see something on a Forum posting and assume it's fact. Speculation is inevitable. How do Sky customers feel about the "iminent" launch of its VoD service that has been promised for three years? And when it finally arrives can't support HD??
an out of date VIP PACK
They're addressing this. And if you check you'll see the VIP 50 is hardly out of date
Sky premium basics and premium negotiations were, to say the least poor.
How can you comment when you have idea what was included and under discussion in negotiations or what the commercial details were?
Taking channels away!
Such as? Rarely Virgin's fault. Channels come and go on all platforms, normally due to the broadcasters rather than the carrier.

[ottoni]

Originally Posted by nialli

"Things that are fundamentally wrong with VM"?

Old and tired looking UI
Wait until TiVo launches at the end of the year. Sky's HD EPG is no better than Virgin's and already looks dated. TiVo will be different.
Lack of SD and HD channels
Believe it or not, we don't all want hundreds and hundreds of useless channels. The only channel available on Sky that I would want is Sky1 HD, and that's launching on Virgin shortly
terrible communication when it comes to new channels or content launching
I wouldn't say it was "terrible" but there is always room for improvement. Too often though folk see something on a Forum posting and assume it's fact. Speculation is inevitable. How do Sky customers feel about the "iminent" launch of its VoD service that has been promised for three years? And when it finally arrives can't support HD??
an out of date VIP PACK
They're addressing this. And if you check you'll see the VIP 50 is hardly out of date
Sky premium basics and premium negotiations were, to say the least poor.
How can you comment when you have idea what was included and under discussion in negotiations or what the commercial details were?
Taking channels away!
Such as? Rarely Virgin's fault. Channels come and go on all platforms, normally due to the broadcasters rather than the carrier.

yes, TIVO is coming, but then isn't everything always coming with VM, and its already been confirmed not all boxes will even be able to get the new tivo software. If you do it means a new box or a new tivo one, very poor VM.

The communication is poor, channel5hd launched without anyone knowing about it, when you phone CS, they are none the wiser about anything, continously mis informing on deals or packages and no one being given the same retention deals etc

Sky premiums were of course negotiated poorly, if they weren't then we would have sky movies classic hd, all the sky hd basics by now, red button etc etc

channels such as mtv classic, yesterday+1, history+1, flaunt, scuzz, bliss, performance channel, more4+1, discovery home and health+1, uktv history+1, uktv documentary+1, animal planet+1, diva tv +1, mtv shows, mtv shows+1, some of us like the choice of more channels even if they are +1

Again the VIP pack is being worked on, again 'coming soon'

[daveybm]

I remember the message "Digital text is coming soon" back in 2000, that never happened either.

Dave

[Sirius]

Originally Posted by ottoni

channels such as mtv classic, yesterday+1, history+1, flaunt, scuzz, bliss, performance channel, more4+1, discovery home and health+1, uktv history+1, uktv documentary+1, animal planet+1, diva tv +1, mtv shows, mtv shows+1, some of us like the choice of more channels even if they are +1

Some of us hate the +1's with a vengeance. That's what a v+ box is for.

[ian@huth]

Originally Posted by Sirius

Some of us hate the +1's with a vengeance. That's what a v+ box is for.

I find that quite often there are 3 programmes that I want to record that are on at the same time. More often than not one of these is on a +1 or even +2 channel. I know that I can record between 6 and 8 programmes at the same time depending on what platforms thay are on but when this happens I usually want to record them on the one TV in the lounge. + channels make this possible.

[Digital Fanatic]

Originally Posted by ottoni

yes, TIVO is coming, but then isn't everything always coming with VM, and its already been confirmed not all boxes will even be able to get the new tivo software. If you do it means a new box or a new tivo one, very poor VM.

The communication is poor, channel5hd launched without anyone knowing about it, when you phone CS, they are none the wiser about anything, continously mis informing on deals or packages and no one being given the same retention deals etc

Sky premiums were of course negotiated poorly, if they weren't then we would have sky movies classic hd, all the sky hd basics by now, red button etc etc

channels such as mtv classic, yesterday+1, history+1, flaunt, scuzz, bliss, performance channel, more4+1, discovery home and health+1, uktv history+1, uktv documentary+1, animal planet+1, diva tv +1, mtv shows, mtv shows+1, some of us like the choice of more channels even if they are +1

Again the VIP pack is being worked on, again 'coming soon'

To be honest, people are going to moan no matter what...

The TIVO deal will be great for the customer... everyone knows how great TIVo boxes and UI are.

Sky weren't going to give Virgin Media ANY Sky HD (except Sports1 and 2 HD - which Ofcom said they must offer)

It took hard negotiating of over a year and the sale of VMtv to get them... they got a great deal.

Five HD... the deal was done last minute - Sky had announced an exclusive launch.. it was so quickly done that VM didn't have a chance to get a press release out first.

People moan if VM announces something early and says it's coming soon and they moan if they are not told it's coming soon

Retention "deals" are between VM and the customer, even Sky do it... when I was with sky many moons ago, I was offered half price packages when I wanted to downgrade etc.

Most customers want new channels and HD ones, over +1 channels.

The VIP20 pack is being worked on... the best VIP pack is VIP50.

[daveetwo]

Originally Posted by Digital Fanatic

People moan if VM announces something early and says it's coming soon and they moan if they are not told it's coming soon

Whilst your quite right about your comment it would be nice if virgin told customers of press releases at the same time as they tell the press.
It would take little effort to at least send an email to those that have an email address and Virgin would not appear to delay telling customers what they tell the press.

For some reason they think the press are more important than paying customers.

[joff81]

Originally Posted by Digital Fanatic

Sky weren't going to give Virgin Media ANY Sky HD (except Sports1 and 2 HD - which Ofcom said they must offer)

It took hard negotiating of over a year and the sale of VMtv to get them... they got a great deal.

still waiting to see any fruits of that deal as i dont subcribe to SKY premium channels !!!

the deal may well of taken over a year but VM have still not aired SKY HD basics (which is the only part of the deal that relevent to most VM coustomers who dont subcribe to SKY premium). so to be honest it was a waste of time negotiating for channels that have not (from a consumer point of view anyway).

[Digital Fanatic]

Originally Posted by daveetwo

Whilst your quite right about your comment it would be nice if virgin told customers of press releases at the same time as they tell the press.
It would take little effort to at least send an email to those that have an email address and Virgin would not appear to delay telling customers what they tell the press.

For some reason they think the press are more important than paying customers.

VM get complaints about "spamming" customers too... like I say, they can't win.

---------- Post added at 12:07 ---------- Previous post was at 12:06 ----------

Originally Posted by joff81

still waiting to see any fruits of that deal as i dont subcribe to SKY premium channels !!!

the deal may well of taken over a year but VM have still not aired SKY HD basics (which is the only part of the deal that relevent to most VM coustomers who dont subcribe to SKY premium). so to be honest it was a waste of time negotiating for channels that have not (from a consumer point of view anyway).

you haven't lost anything from the deal, so anything coming your way is a bonus.

[joff81]

Originally Posted by Digital Fanatic

you haven't lost anything from the deal, so anything coming your way is a bonus.

i never said i had lost anything (other than MTV channels but thats a different story).

what i said is that for all the negotiations that were conducted for over a year ive seen nothing to justify the time and effort put into the negotiations !!!!

people who were willing to pay for SKY premium HD channels have, but for the most who subcribe to XL pack only we have seen nothing come from it.
we were told that SKY HD basics are coming but still we have nothing.
VM keep moving XL only channels to l and M+ packs but add little extra and infact close down channels (MTV Channels). we keep getting promises of channels coming but they never seem to happen or happen really slowly.

[ottoni]

Originally Posted by joff81

i never said i had lost anything (other than MTV channels but thats a different story).

what i said is that for all the negotiations that were conducted for over a year ive seen nothing to justify the time and effort put into the negotiations !!!!

people who were willing to pay for SKY premium HD channels have, but for the most who subcribe to XL pack only we have seen nothing come from it.
we were told that SKY HD basics are coming but still we have nothing.
VM keep moving XL only channels to l and M+ packs but add little extra and infact close down channels (MTV Channels). we keep getting promises of channels coming but they never seem to happen or happen really slowly.

your absolutely spot on, if you want more tv channels then we will have to go to sky. Virgin media don't seem to really care about their customers, and keep taking choices away from them. Who gives a damn about how hard and long the negotiations were, we didn't and haven't seen a positive result from this.
Nothing is guaranteed at all for tv customers from virgin, whereas sky customers get it all 1st time! I don't really see VOD at the moment being overly important. People still want and demand the fullest choice of linear tv channels. This is something that virgin just cannot committ to or can be bothered with. It's either capacity problems, regional variations!
We are basically being told that if you want all the channels, go elsewhere! fair enough, I can understand that, and the choice is there for people.
But I do not want to hear about how hard virgin have had it to get these sky channels. They are a platform, they should provide what the customer wants. And I think the overall message on both DS and this forum is that we want as much choice in linear tv terms as sky does. VOD is nice, but its not going to take the place of linear just yet.
They seriously need to get their act together, TIVO should already be here, not coming soon, this is 2010 not 1981.

[richard1960]

I personally find VM tv ok it has all the channels i want to watch more HD would be nice but compared to what was available 18 months ago its amazing,sky basics HD we know will be launching in the near future,and for people saying tivo should have launched it does take a time to develop a new interface and product,and its due to launch in quarter 4 so not much longer now.

Personally i am only waiting for red button on sky sports! in 2011.

On the whole virgin tv is much better now then even just a few months ago,and i am sure will continue to improve when tivo is launched.

[joff81]

Originally Posted by richard1960

I personally find VM tv ok it has all the channels i want to watch more HD would be nice but compared to what was available 18 months ago its amazing,sky basics HD we know will be launching in the near future,and for people saying tivo should have launched it does take a time to develop a new interface and product,and its due to launch in quarter 4 so not much longer now.

Personally i am only waiting for red button on sky sports! in 2011.

On the whole virgin tv is much better now then even just a few months ago,and i am sure will continue to improve when tivo is launched.

its all good and well saying "look how for VM have come in 18 months" but lets not forget this is a moving target. VM may well of added a few HD channels but Sky have added more and VM still dont have as many as Sky had 2 years ago !!
in terms of comparison even with the few HD channels VM have added they have still fallen even further behind Sky than they were 18 months ago.
Channels getting axed here and there cutting the choice down instead of adding to the current channels it seems broadcasters need to decide along with VM which channels get cut to launch new ones, there is none of that on SKY.

as for TiVo its nothing new TiVo has been around for years and its only now that VM have decided its worth an investment. the US have had it for over a decade going on 2.

Sky have bought VM`s tv assets, launched more HD channels (46 altogether soon to be 50 compared to VM`s 27), added to thier current SD offerings with few/no channels removed.

what as VM done ? removed channels to make room for others, sold out to Sky, not added half of what they negotiated for and lost their biggest bargaining chip with Sky in the process.

the future does look a little better with the promise of a few more HD channels but the whole TiVo offering is going to be a high priced premium nieche offering for at least 12 -18 months priced so high tech thats been around for years that most subsribers will by pass it so thats it.

the only thing for the avarage XL subcriber to look foreward to is a few HD cannels sometime between now and when Vm seem fit to launch them within the next 9 years as that is the length of the carrage deal trhat VM negotiated for when selling up.

[ottoni]

It just makes me so mad that some posters on here think that virgin have bent over backwards for us. Put simply they haven't. They haven't invested enough, they haven't been successful in channel negotiations, they haven't been quick enough in bringing out technology, they lag desperately behind other countries cable sytems let alone sky in this country.
I know there will always be people ready to fly to virgins defence in just about everything they do, but why should we put up with a second rate service?
Its time we let virgin know that they need to be on the ball a lot quicker then they are now. To be honest freesat is a godsend, just to give a bit more variety then virgins xl pack gives. And before you go on about VOD, I'm talking linear content, Vm just dissapoints time and time again.