Virgin Media in talks over bringing back Sky

[the-cable-guy]

Sky News is ok but Sky News Active is even better, but even if Sky News comes back to VM, i doubt that Sky News Active will be available.

[supremus]

Originally Posted by Mick

That is again, in your opinion. If Sky was a better product why am I and millions of others not rushing out to order it?

But then you might as well use that logic to argue that McDonald's is as good as real food, simply by virtue of people buying it, but we can make more or less objective assessments about price, taste, nutritional value, etc, just like we can compare the price and features between Virgin and Cable, and I think most people would agree that Sky offer a superior service. That's not to say Virgin isn't better suited for some people, but there's a reason even Virgin themselves have said they can't compete with Sky's television package, choosing instead to focus on broadband and other services.

[batchain]

Originally Posted by supremus

...just like we can compare the price and features between Virgin and Cable, and I think most people would agree that Sky offer a superior service.

I don't agree and, I suspect, neither do the vast majority which is why Virgin Media is not only the number one broadband ISP but also the most popular pay tv service in its marketable areas and why when industry title Marketing magazine last week revealed the results of its annual brand survey - Virgin Media was the sixth most loved brand while Sky was revealed as the 39th most-hated brand in the UK.


Top 10 Loved Brands…


1. Nokia
2. Tesco
3. iPod
4. O2
5. Facebook
6. Virgin Media
7. BBC One
8. Next
9. Asda
10. Marks & Spencer.


Virgin Media also won the battle of the ISPs by a significant margin, while Sky fell behind BT in third place.

Most loved ISP - %
Virgin Media - 24.3
BT Openworld - 12.8
Sky - 8.1
AOL - 7.5
Tiscali - 5.7

Most hated ISP - %
AOL - 25.5
BT Openworld - 10.7
Sky - 7.9
Tiscali - 7.5
Orange Home UK - 4.7

That's not to say Virgin isn't better suited for some people,

Not just some. The majority of digital pay tv subs (and digital pay tv net adds each quarter) in Virgin Media addressable areas belong to Virgin Media.

but there's a reason even Virgin themselves have said they can't compete with Sky's television package,

Virgin not only compete with, but beat Sky when going head to head - Virgin offer the most comprehensive pay tv package in the UK which is why they rightfully claim superiority over Sky in pay tv and why they are marketing on demand tv & broadband as their hero products.

This is what Virgin's CEO actually said about competing in the TV marketplace...


Premium TV (Sky Sports & Movies, Setanta Sports) - This market is not growing and requires heavy investment and content, primarily movies and sports, to compete. Due to content locked-up by our satellite competitor, this makes the economics here difficult for us to compete effectively. So, the opportunity for us here today is relatively limited compared to other opportunities. Of course, as you know, we are addressing some of our concerns about market behaviour to regulators and will continue to pursue all avenues to ensure a level playing field going forward.

Pay TV ( Virgin Size L & XL TV Vs Sky 1 to 6 Mixes) - The market is growing nicely and is driven by choice and price. We are well placed here with our wide range of Video on Demand functionality and content. We also offer some richer content than our competitors. For example, we include standard sports and live premiership football in our basic [XL TV] pack. We have superiority [over Sky] in the mid TV space. Broadband is our hero product, but it is our hero product within the Quad-play.

Free DTV - Freeview leads the market with nine million homes and growth is continuing, however, many of these consumers are dissatisfied with the range and choice of content. By bundling with a phone line and giving access to VoD content, we can offer greater choice and then we have the opportunity to try and up sell and cross sell other services. We want to take advantage of the appetite of consumers who get the taste of multi-channel television through Freeview.

[supremus]

Originally Posted by batchain

I don't agree and, I suspect, neither do the vast majority which is why Virgin Media is not only the number one broadband ISP but also the most popular pay tv service in its marketable areas and why when industry title Marketing magazine last week revealed the results of its annual brand survey - Virgin Media was the sixth most loved brand while Sky was revealed as the 39th most-hated brand in the UK.

Completely misleading, since this encompasses the entire brand, not just the television division, which is the issue here. There's no question Virgin's broadband service gave it a huge leg up in this poll.

Not just some. The majority of digital pay tv subs (and digital pay tv net adds each quarter) in Virgin Media addressable areas belong to Virgin Media.

But that's exactly the McDonald's argument. Their apparent popularity is in no way an indication of the quality of the service they offer. In many Virgin enabled areas, getting a Sky dish installed is often difficult, sometimes impossible, other times not allowed, never mind the fact that dishes are somewhat of an eye-sore. If you look at what Sky's television package offers, though, it's like a 5 star meal to Virgin's McHappy Burger. Bon appetit.

[the-cable-guy]

Originally Posted by supremus

Completely misleading, since this encompasses the entire brand, not just the television division, which is the issue here.

i was just thinking the same thing, plus if you look at Sky's international companies in New Zealand for example Sky would win hands down, then add Fox & News Corporation & again they'd win hands down.

Originally Posted by supremus

There's no question Virgin's broadband service gave it a huge leg up in this poll.

as did Virgin Atlantic & Virgin Trains.

[Toto]

Originally Posted by the-cable-guy

i was just thinking the same thing, plus if you look at Sky's international companies in New Zealand for example Sky would win hands down, then add Fox & News Corporation & again they'd win hands down.



as did Virgin Atlantic & Virgin Trains.

AND...Virgin Money, and this is the point. Virgin is a recognised brand for obvious reasons, it has a reputable portfolio of services that customers recognise.

[spiderplant]

Originally Posted by the-cable-guy

as did Virgin Atlantic & Virgin Trains.

Virgin Atlantic was at number 33 in the 'most loved' list. Virgin Trains did not feature in either the most loved or most hated 50 brands (I find that quite surprising!).

[Maggy J]

Originally Posted by supremus

But then you might as well use that logic to argue that McDonald's is as good as real food, simply by virtue of people buying it, but we can make more or less objective assessments about price, taste, nutritional value, etc, just like we can compare the price and features between Virgin and Cable, and I think most people would agree that Sky offer a superior service. That's not to say Virgin isn't better suited for some people, but there's a reason even Virgin themselves have said they can't compete with Sky's television package, choosing instead to focus on broadband and other services.

That's because they cannot compete against a company that has the largest,deepest pockets in media.Sky can and has just outbid everyone else for so many events and programmes.You also have to pay a fairly good whack for them as a consequence.

---------- Post added at 10:00 ---------- Previous post was at 09:58 ----------

Originally Posted by spiderplant

Virgin Atlantic was at number 33 in the 'most loved' list. Virgin Trains did not feature in either the most loved or most hated 50 brands (I find that quite surprising!).

That's because when things go wrong Virgin reportedly give out free booze.

[the-cable-guy]

Originally Posted by spiderplant

Virgin Atlantic was at number 33 in the 'most loved' list. Virgin Trains did not feature in either the most loved or most hated 50 brands (I find that quite surprising!).

seems strange to me that does.

[supremus]

Originally Posted by the-cable-guy

as did Virgin Atlantic & Virgin Trains.

Yes, I think it's fair to assume Virgin's universally recognisable branding would mean the poll result doesn't reflect an objective assessment of just the media division, and most certainly not of their television service.

Originally Posted by Incognitas

That's because they cannot compete against a company that has the largest,deepest pockets in media.Sky can and has just outbid everyone else for so many events and programmes.You also have to pay a fairly good whack for them as a consequence.

Correct, but considering the relatively small price difference between Sky's 5 star gourmet meal, and Virgin's greasy McHappy Burger, I'd say Sky is actually very good value for money.

[harmitage]

It's all about opinions. I've had both Sky and Virgin and both have some advantages over the other.

IMHO
Sky advantage:
interactive facility on Sky Sports
EPG loads quicker.

Virgin advantages
Great VOD
Able to still view TV while surfing the EPG
Able to record 2 progs while viewing a third on V+
The inclusion of Setanta Sports in the XL package.
Far less prone to interference caused by weather.
No maintenance outlay for stb
In my experience far superior Customer Service
No ugly dish on the outside of your house.

I'm more than happy with VM although I do hope if they're talking to Sky they'll sort something out about the Red button on Sky sports. Not too bothered about the Sky channels, I missed Sky Sports news for a while but Setanta sports news does the job.

[the-cable-guy]

Originally Posted by Toto

AND...Virgin Money, and this is the point. Virgin is a recognised brand for obvious reasons, it has a reputable portfolio of services that customers recognise.

however they are renowned for cocking things up.

---------- Post added at 15:47 ---------- Previous post was at 15:46 ----------

Originally Posted by supremus

Yes, I think it's fair to assume Virgin's universally recognisable branding would mean the poll result doesn't reflect an objective assessment of just the media division, and most certainly not of their television service.

yep i agree.

[domo247]

Originally Posted by grabbi

Oh boy. youve asked a question which is gonna be the topic of some debate now.

As far as "Virgin in talks with Sky about bringing channels back"... Im sick of hearing it.

Its the same thing thats being said every few months, and people publish this on sites to keep getting hits, and to make it look news worthy. We all know it isnt. The Sky channels ARENT COMING BACK!!!!

Otherwise, why would there be a court case going on?

Virgin are saving money, and growing well WITHOUT the Sky Channels. It would be against the better judgment of a businessman to bring them back, because they have no value to Virgin.

Virgin is growing perfectly, WITHOUT these channels.

And, Lee, if your wife is wanting to watch Gladiators, Id be worried.

Out of court settlement – Virgin and Sky may realise that’s in the best of both their interests. So the court case is irrelevant and even with the court case on Sky still could not refuse to enter normal negotiations with Virgin even if they hate them.

Secondly Virgin is not really growing nicely without Sky – whether it would be better with Sky Channels is another question – but the virgin directors need to do something to improve its fortunes, that’s clear to see with Branson’s blasé attitude to Virgin and constant takeover talks etc. Profit figures and Virgin's suggestion on concentrating mainly on Broadband also back this up.

[photodude]

Must admit, I thought I would miss sky one etc when it all got switched off. But I now couldn't care less what sky does, or if VM get the channels back.
VM are doing a good job of entertaining people, without the sky basics IMHO. Who needs repeats of Simpsons and the odd new program dragged back to life from the 90's. Gladiators was rubbish first time round, so why do it again Plus the new cast look like something from a cheep p0rn film. But I do hope that any court case or negotiated result goes against Sky, just so VM (and it's customers) can rub it in

[the-cable-guy]

? how can you know if the new Gladiators is rubbish if you'v never seen it before ?