Disappointed After Tv Upgrade

[smarties]

Hello all. I had a Philips 32" HD ready connected to my V+ via scart and was very happy with the picture but it was not HDMI and as such the installer advised me to get a HDMI tv which I have, a 40" Toshiba.

I have now configured the new TV to work through the HDMI cable (purchased a better one than the engineer left and I am to be honest really disappointed with the picture. It worse than my old TV through scart was. Okay I can see a difference when watching BBC HD etc but overall the other channels are pretty crap, very blocky and smudged colours. I am unsure if this is a symptom of getting a bigger screen and the picture being stretched. I have noticed that when I am in the menus and you get a small screen (picture in picture?) that picture is superb so I can only imagine something is lost when it goes full screen.

Nothing worse than the missus moaning how we should have stuck with the other TV after me assuring her it would be a better picture

Also my TV wont automatically recognise when I turn the V+ box on I have to tune the TV to HDMI1 everytime is this a setting on the TV or the V+ box anyone?

Anyone else settled for a worse picture to have a bigger screen?

Thanks

[ahardie]

Most people say the V+ picture is excellent over HDMI. A minority say they are disappointed though and notice similar problems that you have. Usually this is with an LCD screen. I have seen people say that it is better once they have adjusted the settings for their particular tv. It might be best to have a look at the avforums to see what people say is the best settings for the Toshiba.

[higgsfield]

Welcome Smarties.

I would suggest that you view the pictures in their original aspect ratio. If you stretch the picture, there is bound to be degradation.

Also, make sure that the resolution of the HDMI output matches the TV (you didn't say what resolution the screen has).

Bear in mind - if the picture is bigger, then you need to increase resolution to avoid blurring of the low-level detail. At 40" you will probably benefit from a full-HD resolution...

In any case - if you sit too close, you will see problems so you shouldn't pick a screen which is too large for your viewing distance.

[smarties]

Originally Posted by higgsfield

Welcome Smarties.

I would suggest that you view the pictures in their original aspect ratio. If you stretch the picture, there is bound to be degradation.

Sorry total novice with this stuff. You mean like view it in 4.3 or something? Is that when you have them black blank bars down the sides? Kind of makes me feel I am wasting the 40" of the screen if you know what I mean

Also, make sure that the resolution of the HDMI output matches the TV (you didn't say what resolution the screen has).

As in 720 or 1080? The TV is 1080p so set to both 1080p and 720 widescreen with 720 widescreen giving the best picture at least when I am in the menu mode of v+ its blurred on 1080 widescreen (the menus) but I read this is a fault of the box. With no difference in viewing mode I left it on 720.

Bear in mind - if the picture is bigger, then you need to increase resolution to avoid blurring of the low-level detail. At 40" you will probably benefit from a full-HD resolution...

As in 1080?

In any case - if you sit too close, you will see problems so you shouldn't pick a screen which is too large for your viewing distance.

Yea I have noticed that and our room is pretty small. Glad we never plumped for the 42". We were drawn to the Toshiba 40XF355DB by the ultra slim frame it looks the dogs very happy with that aspect at least. Thanks for the response all

[higgsfield]

First of all - apologies for that slightly "stream of consciousness" message. It was hurried and a bit disorganised!

Originally Posted by smarties

Sorry total novice with this stuff. You mean like view it in 4.3 or something? Is that when you have them black blank bars down the sides? Kind of makes me feel I am wasting the 40" of the screen if you know what I mean

Most TV these days is 16:9 so unless you are glued to repeats of George and Mildred all day I am sure you'll make good use of the full screen.

Stretching a 4:3 picture to fill the screen seems daft to me. It looks horrible. People are short and fat and you get nasty visual artefacts - especially visible on the large screen.

When we all had 4:3 TVs they didn't squeeze the picture on films (often) to get rid of the black bars top and bottom, did they!?!?

If you really can't stand the blank side bars - perhaps experiment with the zoom options. This is maybe equivalent to the pan'n'scan approaches used in the old days...

Originally Posted by smarties

As in 720 or 1080? The TV is 1080p so set to both 1080p and 720 widescreen with 720 widescreen giving the best picture at least when I am in the menu mode of v+ its blurred on 1080 widescreen (the menus) but I read this is a fault of the box. With no difference in viewing mode I left it on 720.

I didn't make this point very well - sorry. If the TV is a full HD set, experiment with the 720p and 1080p options (I prefer the 1080i - but others disagree). Don't be fooled by the clarity (or otherwise) of the on-screen menus - this can be very misleading. Look at the TV picture after setting the options.

And (at the risk of labouring the point) avoid the 720wide and 1080wide settings - unless you like evrything squat!

Originally Posted by smarties

As in 1080?

Well - yes, but I was getting more at the next point:-

Originally Posted by smarties

Yea I have noticed that and our room is pretty small. Glad we never plumped for the 42". We were drawn to the Toshiba 40XF355DB by the ultra slim frame it looks the dogs very happy with that aspect at least. Thanks for the response all

Perhaps it is a little too large for your viewing distance - whioch is why you are underwhelmed with the picture - it's almost aas if you were watching it through a magnifying glass!!!

[Ernie_C]

Originally Posted by higgsfield

Perhaps it is a little too large for your viewing distance.....

This almost certainly the problem. Perhaps the OP could advise how far away from his LCD he is sitting?

[nialli]

Also, it may be worth the OP checking out over on AV forums to see if there are any recommendations for settings on his Toshiba; I fiddled with the colour settings of mine for the best part of a year before I was 100% happy.

I checked all the settings recently for some friends who'd bought a new Samsung panel but were getting a terribly blocky picture from their Sky box. I found the box was zooming in on 4:3 output from the Sky box, which is how the installer had set it up. Couple of changes later and voila! Much better picture (but still not a patch on that from my V+).

Could also be a faulty HDMI input on the TV - has the OP tried it with another (the Tosh should have 2 or even 3)? The need to re-set it to HDMI-1 each time suggests a problem with the input or even the TV itself, as the Toshiba Regza default to the last input used.

[smarties]

Originally Posted by nialli

Also, it may be worth the OP checking out over on AV forums to see if there are any recommendations for settings on his Toshiba; I fiddled with the colour settings of mine for the best part of a year before I was 100% happy.

I checked all the settings recently for some friends who'd bought a new Samsung panel but were getting a terribly blocky picture from their Sky box. I found the box was zooming in on 4:3 output from the Sky box, which is how the installer had set it up. Couple of changes later and voila! Much better picture (but still not a patch on that from my V+).

Could also be a faulty HDMI input on the TV - has the OP tried it with another (the Tosh should have 2 or even 3)? The need to re-set it to HDMI-1 each time suggests a problem with the input or even the TV itself, as the Toshiba Regza default to the last input used.

Thanks all. In answer to another post I am sat perhaps 10ft from the screen. I havent tried another HDMI socket, there are 3 so I will have a bash. I am taking the TV back tomorrow anyway to either swap or refund as last night I noticed 2 things. One was the picture seemed to have dark spots spreading from the corners into the middle of the screen (not all the way) but noticable, like a photo with the corners blacked out. The worse thing was the sound. Almost like a cricket in the background. I could hear it but never twigged it was the tv until we turned the V+ box off, the tv screen went blue and the only sound was this loud cricket noise. It was coming from behind the right side of the Tv like a speaker or something was on the way out. This Tv btw was a ex display model so I assume was left running for what I was told was only a week so maybe that was a mistake anyway

Thanks for the comments all

[nialli]

Originally Posted by smarties

Thanks all. In answer to another post I am sat perhaps 10ft from the screen. I havent tried another HDMI socket, there are 3 so I will have a bash. I am taking the TV back tomorrow anyway to either swap or refund as last night I noticed 2 things. One was the picture seemed to have dark spots spreading from the corners into the middle of the screen (not all the way) but noticable, like a photo with the corners blacked out. The worse thing was the sound. Almost like a cricket in the background. I could hear it but never twigged it was the tv until we turned the V+ box off, the tv screen went blue and the only sound was this loud cricket noise. It was coming from behind the right side of the Tv like a speaker or something was on the way out. This Tv btw was a ex display model so I assume was left running for what I was told was only a week so maybe that was a mistake anyway

Thanks for the comments all

Definitely sounds like a duff TV I'm afraid. I'd get that replaced pdq

[Chorlton]

Not sure which Toshiba you got but I googled and found an audio/video forum which had recommended settings for my TV (Toshiba z3030)

[foreverwar]

I have the Tosh 40XF355DB attached to my V+ box on HDMI1, and viewing it from about 8-10 away, it's fine on upscaled SD (imho). Not as good as watching BBC HD, but no noticeable pixellation or blurring.

(not just my opinion - a couple of my neighbours remarked on the quality of the picture).

[rare uk]

Originally Posted by foreverwar

I have the Tosh 40XF355DB attached to my V+ box on HDMI1, and viewing it from about 8-10 away, it's fine on upscaled SD (imho). Not as good as watching BBC HD, but no noticeable pixellation or blurring.

(not just my opinion - a couple of my neighbours remarked on the quality of the picture).

I just got my V+ installed today and connected to the exact same telly and my first impressions are wow. That, oooh, all of one channel looks beautiful. The SD looks pretty good too. It must be as even the Mrs said the picture was good and she doesn't normally notice stuff like that.

[oliver1948uk]

I also have a Toshiba 40XF355 and am extremely satisfied with the picture from V+ via HDMI, but I had to make many picture adjustments (mainly turning things down) and turning off various so called enhancements to get what I consider to be an excellent picture. I have V+ on 1080 wide (sorry, but I prefer 4:3 broadcasts to fill the whole screen, even though people sometimes appear fat, but I know some folks on this forum find this extremely irritating)

---------- Post added at 21:51 ---------- Previous post was at 21:47 ----------

Further to the above, a while back I found somebody's recommendations for the 40XF355 on a forum somewhere. It is a good starting point, but I think it makes the picture too dar5k:

Toshiba set up

Active Backlight on
Cinema mode on
3d colour mgt on
Backlight 29
Contrast 88
Brightness 60
Color 46
Tint 0
Sharpness 0
Black stretch off
Stable sound on
Dnr auto
Colour temp warm

Exact scan when using 1080p source

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by rare uk

I just got my V+ installed today and connected to the exact same telly and my first impressions are wow. That, oooh, all of one channel looks beautiful. The SD looks pretty good too. It must be as even the Mrs said the picture was good and she doesn't normally notice stuff like that.

Yes, I got exactly the same reaction from my wife - and the picture really is great with a V+ box and an HD ready telly.

The only thing is, the older programmes now look pretty naff!

I would say to anyone who is experiencing a bad picture with a V+ box, you have either got a duff box or telly, or you have wired it up incorrectly.

I would never go back to a standard box after this!

[Richard Howard]

Location: Burnley Area, Lancashire, UK

I run a Samsung LCD TV (46" F8 model one of the highest qulity screen and given 5 stars review in What HiFi Sound & Vision publication) off the Virgin Media service via a Scientific Atlantic V+ Box.

I have notice a disctinct drop in the resolution of main SD channels (BBC1 BBC2 IVT1 ETC which you would not expect to be compressed) over the past week commencing 12th June 2008. I have intermittantly noticed an occasional drop in resolution of an evening over the past few months but this seems to 'clear' the next day and the picture has returned to normal quality.

I've had a service engineer at my house this morning who swapped the V+ box and even adjusted/checked the feed DB signal levels at the network NTE at the end of the street and everything checks out. NONE of my setting on the TV have changed - this is NOT related to the TV as i was enjoying perfectly good image quality on the same screen with the same setting over a week ago for months.

Frankly the picture quality on main SD channels is now to be blunt crap. I've even noticed a slight drop in BBC HD feed quality, far lower then that i've been experiencing for the past 12 months.

I believe the problem is a fundimental network / bandwidth transmission issue. To me this looks like Virgin are compressing feeds to cope with increased bandwidth demand on the network through either increased users and/or widespread use of the recently launched BBCiplayer. I wonder if the rollout of 4 > 10Mbupgrade to DSL services is creating this additional load on the network? The engineer mentioned they were chaning the signalling on the platform to 256K for TV over the next few month so maybe Virgin are experimenting with this and it's customers are now guinea pigs?

I have tried to speak to network engineers at Virgin Media but i'm not convinced I have been put through to anyone senior or knowledgable enough to investigate this throughly and basically been told i have no other recourse for the issue.

I'm now at the point that if it doesn't improve over the next week i'll probably terminate the service in lieu of SKY + SKY HD.

What was a TV quality picture service seems to have deteriorated into a tier 3 quality offering.

If you are considering the Virgin Service and have anything above a 20" TV then at this stage I would not recommend this platform!

Richard Howard.