Could a Data Prevent Act Notice Stop Overseas Call Centres?

[foreverwar]

Originally Posted by popper

a challenge ,it sounds like fun, im swamped right now but if im in the mood later i may take a look

in the mean time perhaps #914 bigbadcol can contribute some data and his experiance in this matter.....

No disrespect, popper, but who should I put my faith in - a poster on an internet forum (which actually mentions the export of data), or a multi-national law firm who were paid hundreds of thousand of pounds for their advice?

This was the same poster who asked these questions

Hello are Ernst & Young either

1) a Hi tech computer company

2) Computer security experts

3) Accountants

He did not appear to realise that E&Y have a very well respected IT Security Audit Section, as well as being accountants, tax specialists, auditors, etc.

[akira]

I agree with everyone else. Unless you were spending hundreds of pounds with VM a month if you tried anything like that they'd just decide that your too much hassle and not worth keeping as a customer and give you notice that they are terminating your account.

VM may want as many customers as possible but only if its of benifit to the company to have you. I've know of customers that have had there accounts terminated for a lot less.

There is no practical way for VM to stop your account being access by someone in India. Even if they agreed to give you a dedicated contact route where you were only delt with by someone in the UK, Your account would still be onthe main computer system. What would happen if some one went into your account by accident in india. Another customer gives the wrong account number and if brings up your account, fair enouth you'd never really know but would the company want to risk it.

---------- Post added at 12:00 ---------- Previous post was at 11:56 ----------

Oh and ever those companies that advertise UK Call Centres still have staff in India. Maybe not call centre staff but all they back office staff.

[*goo]

My understanding of the more intricate parts of the DP Act is not very extensive, however; in my experience any organisation dealing with DPA outside of the EU has to adhere to one of two possible methods.

1] Seek customer approval
2] Satisfy the DPA via contractual requirements to reasonably protect customer data.

If a company selects route 2 (most do) I believe 1] A company does not have to ask your permission and 2] If they do deal outside the EU, there is nothing you can do about it if they have the correct legal measures in place.

Bottom line, you don't like services outside of the UK? Change provider. Good luck finding a telecommunications company, financial services company or other service orientated organisation that doesn't use India (or variants) at all.

In short, answering the OP's question - no, it cannot.

[BenMcr]

I still find these discussions odd. Is the issue that it an overseas call centre, or that is an overseas call centre IN INDIA.

If it was a call centre in America or Australia, would people be so anti-offshore?

Virgin Mobile use an overseas call centre in South Africa, as do other Virgin companies. I don't see a big number of complaints about them.

[Stuart C]

Originally Posted by BenMcr

I still find these discussions odd. Is the issue that it an overseas call centre, or that is an overseas call centre IN INDIA.

If it was a call centre in America or Australia, would people be so anti-offshore?

Virgin Mobile use an overseas call centre in South Africa, as do other Virgin companies. I don't see a big number of complaints about them.

The problem is that there are allegations of massive fraud. It could potentially happen at any call centre (UK based or not), but it would cost a lot more to pay someone off here than it would in, say, India. Pay someone £18,000 here, and you might get some names, but probably wouldn't. Pay someone in India £18,000 (three times their probable annual salary), and you are more likely to get a long list of accounts.

Originally Posted by foreverwar

No disrespect, popper, but who should I put my faith in - a poster on an internet forum (which actually mentions the export of data), or a multi-national law firm who were paid hundreds of thousand of pounds for their advice?

This was the same poster who asked these questions


He did not appear to realise that E&Y have a very well respected IT Security Audit Section, as well as being accountants, tax specialists, auditors, etc.

People (particularly in that other thread) seem to have forgotten that one area of their business people do generally want to be secure is the accounts system. With most business accounts being predominately IT based, it is in the interests of Accountancy Consultancies to investigate security aspects of that IT.

Not to mention the fact that IT security consultants (like any of us) will go for the best salary they can, and Accountants, by their own nature, are often very profitable firms, so they can afford to hire the best help.

That's not to say that the I consider E&Ys report on Phorm to be indepth, accurate or even in compliance with UK law. I don't know for sure that it isn't in compliance. I suspect the report is very accurate, is in compliance with US law (which is weaker in this area than UK law), and is probably as indepth as E&Y could make it.

Regarding the original post, I don't believe any such notice would have any impact on Virgin (even assuming it works at all). Assuming it does work, then Virgin would need hundreds of thousands of people to do it before they will even consider closing their Indian call centres. If only a few people do it (or a few thousand), then Virgin will just terminate the account.

[akira]

Originally Posted by BenMcr

I still find these discussions odd. Is the issue that it an overseas call centre, or that is an overseas call centre IN INDIA.

If it was a call centre in America or Australia, would people be so anti-offshore?

Virgin Mobile use an overseas call centre in South Africa, as do other Virgin companies. I don't see a big number of complaints about them.

I don't agree with any off shore call centres in priciple but I'm not stupid and understand the economics behind it and know that for any business to be competivie these days then its neccesary evil. I personally would lay the blame for it with a 50 50 split between the companies always thinking about the profit and UK consumers always wanting to pay as little as possible.

I would prefer if they must outsorce then out source to country where english is the first language not second. Look at how many people you hear complaining about VM's off shore centres in india to Virgin Mobiles in South Africa.

[Stuart C]

Originally Posted by akira

I don't agree with any off shore call centres in priciple but I'm not stupid and understand the economics behind it and know that for any business to be competivie these days then its neccesary evil. I personally would lay the blame for it with a 50 50 split between the companies always thinking about the profit and UK consumers always wanting to pay as little as possible.

I would prefer if they must outsorce then out source to country where english is the first language not second. Look at how many people you hear complaining about VM's off shore centres in india to Virgin Mobiles in South Africa.

It also depends on the country. Not sure if it's the case now, but Be used to have two call centres. One in Sweden, one in Romania. If you got put through to the Swedish call centre, they were polite, professional, easy to understand and dealt with any queries efficiently.

In Romania, the story was almost totally opposite..

[Chrysalis]

short answer no.

As we seen with BT and phorm even tho a law may make something illegal large companies tend to be allowed to break the law, so in all likelyhood either there will be a loophole, the law simply wont be applied to them or a new law will get drawn up to make it legal.

[SpinyNorman]

now I'm gonna take this ever so slightly off topic here.

If VM would terminate your account if you served them with said DPA notice, theoretically I suppose you could use it to get out of a minimum term contract with them without having to pay the remainder of the contract as it is their decision to terminate your account.

[NTLVictim]

The thing is, people wouldn't mind if the service from offshore on a certain large continent was good, but a look around this very forum will tell you otherwise time and time again...

There are only so many people suited to the job per capita (before you get to the droids), and as services go, Broadband services are WAY down the food chain compared to finance, banking, etc, and VM have an appalling record over here, let alone anywhere else!

You pay peanuts....